Official TROS Spoilers discussion

MaddieDove wrote:The story of how they left the resolution of their final scenes to be decided upon in the editing room is simply unbelievable. There is so much unprofessionalism, I have no words.

I understand the discontentment of everyone involved, Boyega, Isaac, it's really bad and a waste of potential.

The only sincere happy moment we had was watching adorable Domhnall Gleeson. You see that he knows his character is destroyed too, that everything is absurd, but he relishes and gives his cameo cartoonish performance with such gusto, providing the only sincere laughing moment for a disappointed viewer. Thank you, evil Bill Weasly, you were wonderful!

@MaddieDove

I've been thinking more about several of your points.  When you watch the making of documentary on the bonus features and listen to the remarks made by Terrio and the editor after the film was released (and take into account JJ's deafening silence) it's as if nobody involved wanted to commit to any theme or take any responsibility.  I understand that interpretation of art is a give and take between the artist and the consumer, but they were saying that ANY interpretation is valid.  You saw the kiss as romantic?  It was!  You saw the kiss as mere gratitude?  It was!  You saw the kiss as sibling affection?  It was!

Domhnall Gleeson is a fabulous actor and they could have done so much more with him than they did.  What a waste.  I don't blame John Boyega for being disappointed.  The way the film is edited does make him appear, all jokes aside, like he's constantly chasing and yelling after a woman who doesn't want him.  His force sensitivity is so carelessly presented that I've seen many people not even pick up on it.

Lego SW Holiday Special post-TROS with the ST characters, including some of the movie actors, and saga characters interacting with themselves at different ages, apparently. Young Luke with seasoned Rey? Looks like Kylo and Vader are both in it, and Rose is in the included still. This is the first official if non-canon thing they've used the ST actors for since TROS. I know Lego is also doing a full Skywalker Saga video game, so maybe that's why they're being so inclusive of the various eras and characters, but it's interesting seeing people on my timeline who claimed they had pretty much sworn off SW be fully on board for this.

https://www.usatoday.com/story/entertainment/tv/2020/08/13/disney-plus-lego-star-wars-holiday-special-updates-yuletide-miss/3359104001/

Rose is included because it's Rey+BB8 adventure through SW Saga time. So basically she and freinds bookend it cause Rey is trying to get back on time to celebrate with them.

Great news is that #RUKELIVES!!!!!!!!!!!!! Rey and ANH Luke, yes, the young hottie, are the heart of this special. Board the ship before it's full:

Artist:

https://www.artstation.com/artwork/oNyXm

Sacrebleu wrote:

MaddieDove wrote:The story of how they left the resolution of their final scenes to be decided upon in the editing room is simply unbelievable. There is so much unprofessionalism, I have no words.

I understand the discontentment of everyone involved, Boyega, Isaac, it's really bad and a waste of potential.

The only sincere happy moment we had was watching adorable Domhnall Gleeson. You see that he knows his character is destroyed too, that everything is absurd, but he relishes and gives his cameo cartoonish performance with such gusto, providing the only sincere laughing moment for a disappointed viewer. Thank you, evil Bill Weasly, you were wonderful!

@MaddieDove

I've been thinking more about several of your points.  When you watch the making of documentary on the bonus features and listen to the remarks made by Terrio and the editor after the film was released (and take into account JJ's deafening silence) it's as if nobody involved wanted to commit to any theme or take any responsibility.  I understand that interpretation of art is a give and take between the artist and the consumer, but they were saying that ANY interpretation is valid.  You saw the kiss as romantic?  It was!  You saw the kiss as mere gratitude?  It was!  You saw the kiss as sibling affection?  It was!

Domhnall Gleeson is a fabulous actor and they could have done so much more with him than they did.  What a waste.  I don't blame John Boyega for being disappointed.  The way the film is edited does make him appear, all jokes aside, like he's constantly chasing and yelling after a woman who doesn't want him.  His force sensitivity is so carelessly presented that I've seen many people not even pick up on it.

I'm sorry, but they've made all the cast look inane to make Rey look amazing.
As I've said before, many times, if they have to do this with a character, then they haven't written her well enough. I've seen lots of films and TV series with female central protagonists, but they haven't had to belittle the other cast members to make them look good
A few examples:
The Hunger Games
Aliens
Mad Max Fury Road
Once Upon A Time
The Witcher
Cursed

These all have excellent supporting characters, male and female, who have their own story arcs. I'm not a Boyega fan post Instagram gate, but I liked his character, and he deserved better than to be Rey's groupie.

Lego is meta enough with their cartoons, including SW, that I hope they poke fun at TROS a bit, it would go a long way. Like the Shakespeare versions do.

I hope whichever new cast members got strong armed into doing this special are as stoned out of their minds as the OT ones were while making The Holiday Special because it said they had to in their contracts.

Found this article recently, which came out in December after TRoS' release and summarizes the exact reason why it's not just a bad movie, but a bad direction/choice the studio has decided to take. Choosing to see Star Wars as a nostalgia driven product where the criteria is whatever meaning/rituals older fans have impressed on it for decades instead of how Lucas (and Rian Johnson) treated it as actual stories and characters. One makes for a good/memorable/iconic movie, the other doesn't. TFA and TLJ were managed to both tell stories about the characters while also being a meta commentary about the value/danger of looking to history and nostalgia and who doe/doesn't get to make meaning out of a story, including the people who were part of the story. TRoS is 100% about re-assuring the audience that what they want/think is what matters most and that the story/characters are there in service of their safe nostalgia

The Moment I Realized The Rise of Skywalker Was Determined to Undo The Last Jedi




One of the genuinely interesting parts of the ST was seeing via Ben's fall to the darkside and Bloodline what the implications were for Leia finding out who her biological father was and it feels like the last movie was in part some half-a**ed attempt to explore that plotline except graft it on to Rey instead. Basically JJ did a remake of RotJ except "what if Leia gets a light saber instead of a metal bikini and is the character who explores the impact of secret Darkside legacy. Oh and Han dies after kissing her because she's a role model and he made bad choices in the past as a criminal."

Which sums it up perfectly.
I think what made TFA so enjoyable is Kasdan's writing. JJ wrote TROS with Terrio and it was a complete disaster area. For all their desire to pander to nostalgia I'll never understand how they think having Palpatine's granddaughter take name Skywalker can replace erasing every.single.member of the original heroes AND their only descendant.

Palpatine's desire to erase the Skywalkers has succeeded. They have turned an almost Shakespearian family saga, meant to represent hope, into the story of how the bad guy wins. I don't care if internet trolls insist Kylo isn't as 'worthy' of the Skywalker name as Rey, Rey IS PALPATINE'S SEED. That's what they've made her into. His bloodline lives. Anakin's is extinct.
"Try as you might, you cannot deny the truth that is your family."

That part floors me. For all their attempts to pander to the rabid fans, they missed by a mile. Knowing the fans' attachment to the Skywalkers, what in the world made them think it was a good idea to wipe out Anakin's descendants and leave Palpatine's alive?

californiagirl wrote:Lego is meta enough with their cartoons, including SW, that I hope they poke fun at TROS a bit, it would go a long way. Like the Shakespeare versions do.

@californiagirl

true though it seems that it's primarily Rey and PT and OT heroes and major events. Her friends are on Kashykk and Kylo/Vader/Sheev hang out separately from the rest or something.

Sacrebleu wrote:That part floors me. For all their attempts to pander to the rabid fans, they missed by a mile. Knowing the fans' attachment to the Skywalkers, what in the world made them think it was a good idea to wipe out Anakin's descendants and leave Palpatine's alive?

If Ben Solo had lived, it actually could have worked. Anakin's grandson marries Palpatine's granddaughter, and the healing begins.

But...no.

I can’t really agree with the article; “anyone can be a hero” is a fine idea in general but doesn’t really work when you’re talking about a multi-generation story about the same family. Soooo many problems in the ST stem from trying to wedge a complete outsider like Rey into a family saga as the main protagonist. And anyway, we already had a SW movie before TLJ with the unrelated heroine who’s not even force-sensitive, so why wasn’t Rogue One lauded as some sort of game-changer for SW? (Answer: because it didn’t bang on about the hero’s mysterious parents and invite fans to speculate about Jyn’s heritage)

Though "Jyn is Rey's mom" was sure a theory for a while. Seriously, people were so desperate.

I think RO's story is even more strongly connected to ANH/the OT than even TFA in terms of direct continuity, so it often gets written off as being just a big prologue for OT fans that didn't add anything new to SW (though I disagree). Making Jyn not have powers was actually a bold move at the time that didn't get mentioned enough, but that does take away the expectation for her to connect to the saga to begin with, at least as an individual.

Young Luke mhahaha. It took only halfyear to insert young Luke somewhere - the greatest character ever because it's one of two characters 40 years old white males totally approve.

But but Rey is now more seasoned than Young LUke, she's gonna show him how it's done.

Of course she will -
She Is All The Jedi....

motherofpearl1 wrote:Of course she will -
She Is All The Jedi....

@motherofpearl1
And she is All The Sith. She killed Palps after all. 

So further to what was posted here about the lego holiday special - lego Star Wars holiday special has Rey time travelling ( world between worlds portal in a Jedi temple )in a Christmas carol Dickensian type adventure where she meets those from the past and learns the true meaning of “Holiday spirit “. lol !

I'm sorry but this is embarrassingly awful.
What are they trying to do? Make up for ruining last Christmas with DROSS?
Newsflash guys - Mary Rey Sue Fakewalker is..... boring.

AhsokaTano wrote:So further to what was posted here about the lego holiday special - lego Star Wars holiday special has Rey time travelling ( world between worlds portal in a Jedi temple )in a Christmas carol Dickensian type adventure where she meets those from the past and learns the true meaning of “Holiday spirit “. lol !

@AhsokaTano

OMG, what kind of crap is this?
Milking the boring nostalgia, AGAIN. Mixed with boring holy Rey Fakewalker. They stop at nothing.

Given the reputation of the holiday special as being one of the worst things ever, and that being one of the reasons why it has such a cult following, I suspect this might be at least somewhat bad on purpose. I get that it's for Disney+, so it can't be too horrible, but at least make it ridiculous.

Okay,, if they're going for a Christmas theme, birth of Christ, so on, maybe someone can remind Rey - who blows up space ships, likes shooting people, likes stabbing unarmed men, and is too good to love Kylo Ren - of that saying...
'He who is without sin cast the first stone.'

Crying out loud who came up with the idea of making this character so insufferably perfect?

Wow @Geralt_Riv you decoded ST! I knew about the first 2 but Skywalker...rise is a great catch. Supreme Leader was really wise.  

Are you ready to join? Which of you did this:

https://twitter.com/kyIosprmanager/status/1294273150751055876

"I want to watch Rey hanging out with Young!Luke" said no one ever

DLF is such a failure in branding and understanding their audience.

They're really banking on the SW/Lego branding, the infamy of the holiday special, and the fact people are running out of things to watch during quarantine. I wonder if they decided on this before or after TROS.

Usually projects like these have a 6+ month time span of production. So it's possible the concept/pitch was from before TROS or right after it was released.