Solo: A Star Wars Story [NO SPOILERS ALLOWED]

After reading the info you guys posted, if the issue was a disagreement between Kasdan and Lord & Miller on how Han's character should be portrayed, I'm glad KK and LF sided with Kasdan. I have no beef with L&M (I enjoyed the Lego Movie , etc), but I wouldn't want to see Han's sarcasam and selfishness whitewashed or scrubbed away to make him more traditionally likable or funny/silly. The Han Solo movie is set before ANH and we all remember how Han's selfishness and attitude played a huge role in his personality and arc there. He was only in it for the money and he shot Greedo first afterall... That is one reason why Han's role in TFA is so poignant. He came so far from that rouge scondrel who only thought of himself to risking it all to try to reach his son.

The Han Solo movie has to make Han believable. I'm excited for the Han Solo movie, but one of my worst fears is seeing it and feeling like the Han in that movie is a different character from the Han of the saga movies.

Kessel wrote:After reading the info you guys posted, if the issue was a disagreement between Kasdan and Lord & Miller on how Han's character should be portrayed, I'm glad KK and LF sided with Kasdan. I have no beef with L&M (I enjoyed the Lego Movie , etc), but I wouldn't want to see Han's sarcasam and selfishness whitewashed or scrubbed away to make him more traditionally likable or funny/silly. The Han Solo movie is set before ANH and we all remember how Han's selfishness and attitude played a huge role in his personality and arc there. He was only in it for the money and he shot Greedo first afterall... That is one reason why Han's role in TFA is so poignant. He came so far from that rouge scondrel who only thought of himself to risking it all to try to reach his son.

The Han Solo movie has to make Han believable. I'm excited for the Han Solo movie, but one of my worst fears is seeing it and feeling like the Han in that movie is a different character from the Han of the saga movies.

@Kessel

I agree wholeheartedly. Sarcastic and selfish is miles away from an ideal parent image that some of the fans are trying hard to esatblish. Han Solo never hasn't been an ideal guy. And I can't describe enough how happy I'am after reading Kasdan's words.

I feel like the latest development has brought a relief on several fronts.

KK shoots first indeed.

Kylo Men wrote:I'm not sure we're ever going to see this movie. Unless they start from scratch.

@Kylo Men

I wonder, though. Surely they've filmed so much material by now that not all of it needs to be scrapped? There must be some usable material there, too. After all, I assume the story isn't the problem and they like the script as they appear to be siding with Kasdan. So presumably the problems could be fixed in re-shoots like RO, and Edwards wasn't fired just because they had problems with a large part of his film. So are L & M sticking to their vision over Kasdan's to the point that they flat-out refuse to do re-shoots and refuse any meddling? Wouldn't that be a bit boneheaded on a huge project like this? And wouldn't it be weird if they went along with the Kasdan script, "yeah we're doing this", and then in the course of the project decided they want to do something else and aren't compromising?

I don't know anything about how these things work in Hollywood - if a company fires a director, can they still pick and choose and use anything that director has already filmed for the project? And re-do the rest with another director?

Also, if the problem is that L & M didn't stick closely enough to Kasdan's script, wouldn't Lucasfilm have noticed that a long time ago?

Somehow I find all of this puzzling, but then, like I said I know nothing about the way Hollywood works.

Can't say I was ever interested much in this movie, but I was at least curious to see what the Lego Movie guys could do with it. Well now this is gone as well.

I obviously can't know what really happened, but why hire people with a particular vision in the first place if you're not going to let them do their thing?

ISeeAnIsland wrote:Update from The Hollywood Reporter...Some interesting stuff here:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/heat-vision/star-wars-why-han-solo-movie-directors-were-fired-1015474?utm_source=dlvr.it&utm_medium=twitter

Lord and Miller (21 Jump Street, The Lego Movie) have a comedic sensibility and improvisational style while Kasdan favors a strict adherence to the written word — what is on the page is what must be shot.

The creative clash, according to one insider, also came down to differences in understanding the character of Han Solo. “People need to understand that Han Solo is not a comedic personality. He’s sarcastic and selfish,” said that source.

...

Lucasfilm and owner Disney have already targeted their replacement, although the companies are keeping mum.

Ron Howard is one of the names that has emerged, according to sources. Joe Johnston, who directed The Rocketeer and Jumanji, has been mentioned as another possible candidate. Others suggest that Kasdan, who has directed movies like ‪The Big Chill and Silverado, could step in as he is already in prime position to know what needs to be fixed. That move could be complicated by DGA rules preventing someone already working on a film taking over for a director that is being replaced except for a short-term emergency.

They're clearly not going with an Indie Flavor of the Month as the replacement...

@ISeeAnIsland

Ron Howard is interesting, seeing as he was approached by Lucas back in the 90s to helm Episode I.

I also wouldn't mind seeing Johnston return to the world of Star Wars

LOL


Reference is to Lord and Miller likely signing up for Flash, which made the firing easy. Everyone wins.

First of all, I will never understand why Anthony Ingruber was not cast for this film, my bet and my gut feeling is part of this bruhahah is that Alden Ehrenreich is not capturing the essence of Han and pair that with the "improv" style that seems to be at the heart of L&M firing. The dailies probably sucks ballz. Star Wars is paint by numbers, just hire someone who looks like Harrison and stick to the script none of this would have ever happened.



But you can't fire Alden now, sorry I don't care who takes over as director this is a disaster.

they must have known that lord & miller practise a specific type of anarchic comedy (which i happen to love) so why hire them and then want han to not be comedic or whatever. it sounds like a disaster. my ethusiasm for this was slim and rested on the directors and the thought of ron howard??? nah.

christ they seem to flounder. sorry to see that.

guardienne wrote:they must have known that lord & miller practise a specific type of anarchic comedy (which i happen to love) so why hire them and then want han to not be comedic or whatever. it sounds like a disaster. my ethusiasm for this was slim and rested on the directors and the thought of ron howard??? nah.

christ they seem to flounder. sorry to see that.

@guardienne

The impression I'm getting is that Disney walk into these spin-offs with ok let's do something different! attitude, and then go oh no no no no no we don't and back the heck out.

@saracene yes, it's like they have no faith in their own daring. i mean, why do this movie to begin with and there must have been a lot of back and forth already for the directors to walk now when they've already shot (parts of?) the movie. i mean, i didn't think rogue one was a good movie (in many aspects of what i consider good filmmaking) but i would expect that the thrust of each project was discussed, that the script was discussed, that the directorial choices were discussed and not simply left. i mean, even if you think L&M aren't up to helming something like this - which i doubt because they've already worked on 3 projects that were reasonably indicative of how they can handle a cast and crew and still get a movie made that is very watchable (dunno what they did before) and the lego movie can't have been without the lego people's intervention, right? i mean, surely they were worred about their product. - anyway, even if you think that they aren't, surely the producers are? they picked them.

i think it's pathetic to let your directors go. honestly. it's like they have little idea of where this is suposed to go but all that should have been cleared months ago.

i'm not impressed with how the anthology stuff is being handled at all.

i saw a brilliant interview with L&M over how much they treated jump street like animation and found it difficult to conceive of each of their hysterically funny ideas as something that people would have to plan and do, because in animation you just draw something different and voila. but anyway.

Oh god, please not Ron Howard. Mr Nice Guy gave a f**king backstory to the Grinch. Let the Grinch and Han Solo be who they are, which is not needing some exposition about how deep down they're sad and that's why they push people away. Han's an a**hole and reluctant hero in part because he decided that he was more interested in getting into Leia's pants than the reward money. He's also reckless and frequently in over his head which is why I've always bought that Kylo/Ben is very much his kid. Just please, no "we had to make him likeable and wise cracking." He's not that guy, which is why it matters how he ends up putting himself at risk to reach out to Ben after years of shutting down and telling Maz that Leia doesn't want to see him.

Otherwise I saw some crack on Twitter that Rian Johnson is likely hiding some place air conditioned with Edgar Wright riding out the storm. And interesting enough, Jon Kasdan's Twitter feed is full of jabs at reboots. Which sure, is as big a problem as hiring bright young male things for high level projects. But who know, they may have tried to reboot Han and folks weren't having it. Can they have Donald Glover take over if Kasdan's barred because of DGA rules?

I agree with what everyone has said in here so far. I've basically liked every post from yesterday on!

I think one of the reasons they're even bothering with a Han Solo movie at this point in the timeline is because of Kylo and his redemption. Otherwise, why push it ahead of the Boba Fett movie? Sure Han is popular and people hated seeing him die, but there has to be more significance to the release of this movie (between VIII and IX no less) than just a character's popularity.

I like what @SoloSideCousin said. Han Solo movie needs to make him look human and realistic and it needs to make us believe that Kylo could come out the way he did. If they make Han too cutesy, innocent and likeable, the vitriol for Kylo will only increase instead of making him look sypmathetic (which is what TLJ and post TFA marketing seem to be doing).

Here's the thing, KK seems nice and I'll love her forever for suggesting Adam Driver to JJ for Kylo/Ben, but I'm a bit mystified by those saying it increases their faith in her... Um, no, the buck stops with her and, while people make mistakes, they don't get to make too many in the kind of job she holds and survive. I'm sure I read somewhere that her contract as head of Lucasfilm was up this year. I'm not saying she'll go right away, maybe she'll come to some arrangement with Bob Iger and see the ST out, but expensive mistakes like these don't usually get overlooked, especially by Disney! If the business with Colin Trevorrow turns into a fiasco as well, I don't see any saving face from that. I've heard Dave Filoni mentioned as a natural successor to KK but it depends whether Disney want another Lucas heir apparent.

@xylo ren it's fanservice. just like rogue one contained all the fanservice.


they are not trusting their own stories. so they make stories about chracters most people recognise because what if they deviate and nobody will watch? that's why they keep having to have someone from the OT in there because otherwise it's not star wars.

i can imagine a standalone han solo movie that is full of silly daring and banter and gambling and shooting people? and i would watch that, i think. what i'd hate is for this to have to foreshadow and basically make han someone who we need to root for because of how he was made to ba an arsehole or something. i don't know.

i'm really not fond of prequels. they aren't very exciting to begin with. but i was willing to bear with this. god, i feel like such an angry basher. but i'm so not impressed with how each of these films are being processed. it just seems wasteful of people's talents?

Lord and Miller have always been wrong for this movie. So KK is correcting the mistake. I bet that it took them so long to announce their firing because they were waiting for Lord and Miller to sign the Flash contract. Nobody fires directors like they are McDonalds part-timers. They are rapped by powerful agencies, it takes a while before the announcement is made and it's always so that both sides can quickly bounce back with a good news. So TLJ trailer for LF and Flash gig for Lord and Miller.

it depends on the type of movie you wanna make. we don't know what the movie was supposed to be, so we can't really assume that they were right or wrong.

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:Here's the thing, KK seems nice and I'll love her forever for suggesting Adam Driver to JJ for Kylo/Ben, but I'm a bit mystified by those saying it increases their faith in her... Um, no, the buck stops with her and, while people make mistakes, they don't get to make too many in the kind of job she holds and survive. I'm sure I read somewhere that her contract as head of Lucasfilm was up this year. I'm not saying she'll go right away, maybe she'll come to some arrangement with Bob Iger and see the ST out, but expensive mistakes like these don't usually get overlooked, especially by Disney! If the business with Colin Trevorrow turns into a fiasco as well, I don't see any saving face from that. I've heard Dave Filoni mentioned as a natural successor to KK but it depends whether Disney want another Lucas heir apparent.

@Mrs Ben Solo

Yep. Completely baffled by the notion that this is supposed to be be a good thing. It's been a PR disaster for Disney: firing directors in the middle of a production with just three weeks of shooting left is completely unprecedented. Even Gareth Edwards got to finish RO before Lucasfilm brought Tony Gilroy in for reshoots. As for Lord & Miller being comedic directors, did Kathleen Kennedy not watch any of their films before she hired them??? Weren't there lengthy discussions about their vision for the story beforehand??? Not to mention the dailies coming in every day and L & M probably had a rough cut by now too.  What is the point of these anthology films if directors aren't allowed to be creative and ambitious; that is how the OT came about after all. They shouldn't be feeling Star Wars-y anyway, that's what the mainline saga is for. This news coupled with  the fact KK saw Book of Henry in late 2015 and STILL picked him for IX doesn't inspire any confidence.

Sorry for the long rant but I'm just afraid that Disney is 'Marvelising' Star Wars and churning out an assembly line of bland, forgettable blockbusters. (Not that anyone wanted a Han Solo movie anyway lol).

Bad acting was cited as one of reasons for discontent. So it looks like they couldn't direct their actors on top of discarding the script. Since they love improvisation, perhaps some actors are not attuned to that and gave bad performances. Improv is like green screen, not everyone feels comfortable and gets it.

Kylo Rey wrote:

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:Here's the thing, KK seems nice and I'll love her forever for suggesting Adam Driver to JJ for Kylo/Ben, but I'm a bit mystified by those saying it increases their faith in her... Um, no, the buck stops with her and, while people make mistakes, they don't get to make too many in the kind of job she holds and survive. I'm sure I read somewhere that her contract as head of Lucasfilm was up this year. I'm not saying she'll go right away, maybe she'll come to some arrangement with Bob Iger and see the ST out, but expensive mistakes like these don't usually get overlooked, especially by Disney! If the business with Colin Trevorrow turns into a fiasco as well, I don't see any saving face from that. I've heard Dave Filoni mentioned as a natural successor to KK but it depends whether Disney want another Lucas heir apparent.

@Mrs Ben Solo

Yep. Completely baffled by the notion that this is supposed to be be a good thing. It's been a PR disaster for Disney: firing directors in the middle of a production with just three weeks of shooting left is completely unprecedented. Even Gareth Edwards got to finish RO before Lucasfilm brought Tony Gilroy in for reshoots. As for Lord & Miller being comedic directors, did Kathleen Kennedy not watch any of their films before she hired them??? Weren't there lengthy discussions about their vision for the story beforehand??? Not to mention the dailies coming in every day and L & M probably had a rough cut by now too.  What is the point of these anthology films if directors aren't allowed to be creative and ambitious; that is how the OT came about after all. They shouldn't be feeling Star Wars-y anyway, that's what the mainline saga is for. This news coupled with  the fact KK saw Book of Henry in late 2015 and STILL picked him for IX doesn't inspire any confidence.

Sorry for the long rant but I'm just afraid that Disney is 'Marvelising' Star Wars and churning out an assembly line of bland, forgettable blockbusters. (Not that anyone wanted a Han Solo movie anyway lol).

@Kylo Rey

I completely agree. It does seem like the problems between KK and Lord and Miller have been going on for a while and the final straw came with the demand they work with someone else during the upcoming 7 weeks of reshoots. I've also heard that one of the big problems here is that Lucasfilm don't really know what they want from these anthology movies, hence all the confusion and differing visions for the final product. For all the talk of them maybe not continuing the Skywalker saga, methinks they're gonna be needing more Skywalker babies after all!

Also, it was only a rumour about Lord and Miller directing The Flash. Robert Zemeckis is still the front runner to take on that job. http://www.thewrap.com/phil-lord-and-chris-miller-met-with-dc-about-the-flash-during-han-solo-hiatus-exclusive/ DC/Warner have had their share of problems too and I can see them also wanting a safe pair of hands rather than take a chance on Lord and Miller.

WB doesn't want safe. They tried to be anti-Marvel in that they took risks but didn't pull off what they wanted until Wonder Woman. So Lord and Miller would be right up their alley. WB is ambitious, not an assembly line.

vaderito wrote:WB doesn't want safe. They tried to be anti-Marvel in that they took risks but didn't pull off what they wanted until Wonder Woman. So Lord and Miller would be right up their alley. WB is ambitious, not an assembly line.

@vaderito

Hmm, yeah, that's why they went to Joss Whedon to finish Justice League...

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:

vaderito wrote:WB doesn't want safe. They tried to be anti-Marvel in that they took risks but didn't pull off what they wanted until Wonder Woman. So Lord and Miller would be right up their alley. WB is ambitious, not an assembly line.

@vaderito

Hmm, yeah, that's why they went to Joss Whedon to finish Justice League...

@Mrs Ben Solo

Eh, I would argue that WB aren't 'safe' either. They're a very director-friendly studio, almost to a fault (see the Wachowski's, Guy Ritchie etc). They're home to some of the most prestigious directors (Nolan, Kubrick, George Miller, GdT, Clint Eastwood, Villeneuve etc). You wouldn't see Mad Max Fury Road or the upcoming $200m R-rated Blade Runner at many other studios for example.

Kylo Rey wrote:

Mrs Ben Solo wrote:

vaderito wrote:WB doesn't want safe. They tried to be anti-Marvel in that they took risks but didn't pull off what they wanted until Wonder Woman. So Lord and Miller would be right up their alley. WB is ambitious, not an assembly line.

@vaderito

Hmm, yeah, that's why they went to Joss Whedon to finish Justice League...

@Mrs Ben Solo

Eh, I would argue that WB aren't 'safe' either. They're a very director-friendly studio, almost to a fault (see the Wachowski's, Guy Ritchie etc). They're home to some of the most prestigious directors (Nolan, Kubrick, George Miller, GdT, Clint Eastwood, Villeneuve etc). You wouldn't see Mad Max Fury Road or the upcoming $200m R-rated Blade Runner at many other studios for example.

@Kylo Rey

I guess, although they've had a lot of flops or got the box office but not the critical acclaim. I suppose they'd rather have the money than the praise, but they'd like both if they can get it, as with Wonder Woman. Maybe they will go with Lord and Miller rather than an old hand like Robert Zemeckis, although his track record isn't to be sniffed at. I know the situation with Justice League is different because Whedon wasn't brought in to replace Synder because of "creative differences", but he is doing extensive reshoots all the same. I think DC/Warner have been finding their feet with all this like Disney/Lucasfilm and the anthology movies (and the ST to an extent).

Joss Whedon is not a good example. He offered his help so that Snyder could have time to grieve. It's a different situation. Compassionate reason, not a conflict.

vaderito wrote:Joss Whedon is not a good example. He offered his help so that Snyder could have time to grieve. It's a different situation. Compassionate reason, not a conflict.

@vaderito

I said in my reply to KyloRey that it isn't the same, but Whedon is doing extensive reshoots and he's done something similar for Marvel with the Avengers. Like I said, maybe WB will go for Lord and Miller, that's not the word at the moment but who knows! If they start badmouthing Lucasfilm it will be another Josh Trank situation and likely no studio will want to take them on. If they keep a dignified silence, they'll probably bounce back pretty quickly.