The Last Jedi: General Discussion

About a month ago, I dreamed that I was watching TLJ and Rey Solo was about to become canon, everything was suggesting that Rey was Leia's daughter (I don't remember the details but I was like: "Noooooo!" ), but later Rey and Kylo found out that it was just a red herring and then Reylo became canon with an almost kiss (because I woke up   ).

1. I don't get one thing - now it's kind of canon that Han was father figure for Rey. But I can't understand how. they had 1 little conversation and some extreme situations where they saw in another that both know pilot things. Han invited her for job...
Soo how is he father figure? I'm I only one who thinks it's bullshit ?
There is no way she never talked to anyone in her life more than this, even for her lonely life it would be too much!

2. TFA is the only movie in franchise with open ending, that mush open at list, when next movie will continue from the same minute. Every movie has ending because between movies must be time gap, it's good, because with this time gaps and 3 movie we see history of 1 generation. if movies where without gap trilogy would be 1 month Long time is good to see character development and etc.
so how do u think, why they did it? what was so big reason to change "rules"?

Anakin Skywalker wrote:1. I don't get one thing - now it's kind of canon that Han was father figure for Rey. But I can't understand how. they had 1 little conversation and some extreme situations where they saw in another that both know pilot things. Han invited her for job...
Soo how is he father figure? I'm I only one who thinks it's bullshit ?
There is no way she never talked to anyone in her life more than this, even for her lonely life it would be too much!

2. TFA is the only movie in franchise with open ending, that mush open at list, when next movie will continue from the same minute. Every movie has ending because between movies must be time gap, it's good, because with this time gaps and 3 movie we see history of 1 generation. if movies where without gap trilogy would be 1 month Long time is good to see character development and etc.
so how do u think, why they did it? what was so big reason to change "rules"?

@Anakin Skywalker

I don't really get the Han thing too. He's the first adult/authority figure to be kind to her versus what we know about her life on Niima as an orphan at the mercy of figures like Plutt. Rey's relationship with Finn as her brother figure should be emphasized above and beyond anything between her and Han. Finn is more of a family member to Rey than Han would have ever been and Finn sustained those injuries coming to her defense. He also ticks off the "my family is coming back for me" line because he's the person who gets her off of Jakku. So any conflict between Rey and Kylo, her loyalty to Finn as the person who's the only family she'll ever have should be emphasized above and beyond how she felt about Han.

snufkin wrote:

Anakin Skywalker wrote:1. I don't get one thing - now it's kind of canon that Han was father figure for Rey. But I can't understand how. they had 1 little conversation and some extreme situations where they saw in another that both know pilot things. Han invited her for job...
Soo how is he father figure? I'm I only one who thinks it's bullshit ?
There is no way she never talked to anyone in her life more than this, even for her lonely life it would be too much!

2. TFA is the only movie in franchise with open ending, that mush open at list, when next movie will continue from the same minute. Every movie has ending because between movies must be time gap, it's good, because with this time gaps and 3 movie we see history of 1 generation. if movies where without gap trilogy would be 1 month Long time is good to see character development and etc.
so how do u think, why they did it? what was so big reason to change "rules"?

@Anakin Skywalker

I don't really get the Han thing too. He's the first adult/authority figure to be kind to her versus what we know about her life on Niima as an orphan at the mercy of figures like Plutt. Rey's relationship with Finn as her brother figure should be emphasized above and beyond anything between her and Han. Finn is more of a family member to Rey than Han would have ever been and Finn sustained those injuries coming to her defense. He also ticks off the "my family is coming back for me" line because he's the person who gets her off of Jakku. So any conflict between Rey and Kylo, her loyalty to Finn as the person who's the only family she'll ever have should be emphasized above and beyond how she felt about Han.

@snufkin

Agree!
+if she was loyal to her family for so long, she was waiting them no matter what for her whole life, then it's not logical to see someone as father with 1 conversation. For someone soo obsessed on her REAL family not natural to attach to firs meeting old guy

snufkin wrote:

Anakin Skywalker wrote:1. I don't get one thing - now it's kind of canon that Han was father figure for Rey. But I can't understand how. they had 1 little conversation and some extreme situations where they saw in another that both know pilot things. Han invited her for job...
Soo how is he father figure? I'm I only one who thinks it's bullshit ?
There is no way she never talked to anyone in her life more than this, even for her lonely life it would be too much!

2. TFA is the only movie in franchise with open ending, that mush open at list, when next movie will continue from the same minute. Every movie has ending because between movies must be time gap, it's good, because with this time gaps and 3 movie we see history of 1 generation. if movies where without gap trilogy would be 1 month Long time is good to see character development and etc.
so how do u think, why they did it? what was so big reason to change "rules"?

@Anakin Skywalker

I don't really get the Han thing too. He's the first adult/authority figure to be kind to her versus what we know about her life on Niima as an orphan at the mercy of figures like Plutt. Rey's relationship with Finn as her brother figure should be emphasized above and beyond anything between her and Han. Finn is more of a family member to Rey than Han would have ever been and Finn sustained those injuries coming to her defense.  He also ticks off the "my family is coming back for me" line because he's the person who gets her off of Jakku. So any conflict between Rey and Kylo, her loyalty to Finn as the person who's the only family she'll ever have should be emphasized above and beyond how she felt about Han.

@snufkin

Plus, if we take out that whole "father figure" line maybe people would be more receptive to Reylo I can't count how many times I have read something like, "But Kylo killed her father figurrrrrre"

adamdrivershair wrote:

snufkin wrote:

Anakin Skywalker wrote:1. I don't get one thing - now it's kind of canon that Han was father figure for Rey. But I can't understand how. they had 1 little conversation and some extreme situations where they saw in another that both know pilot things. Han invited her for job...
Soo how is he father figure? I'm I only one who thinks it's bullshit ?
There is no way she never talked to anyone in her life more than this, even for her lonely life it would be too much!

2. TFA is the only movie in franchise with open ending, that mush open at list, when next movie will continue from the same minute. Every movie has ending because between movies must be time gap, it's good, because with this time gaps and 3 movie we see history of 1 generation. if movies where without gap trilogy would be 1 month Long time is good to see character development and etc.
so how do u think, why they did it? what was so big reason to change "rules"?

@Anakin Skywalker

I don't really get the Han thing too. He's the first adult/authority figure to be kind to her versus what we know about her life on Niima as an orphan at the mercy of figures like Plutt. Rey's relationship with Finn as her brother figure should be emphasized above and beyond anything between her and Han. Finn is more of a family member to Rey than Han would have ever been and Finn sustained those injuries coming to her defense.  He also ticks off the "my family is coming back for me" line because he's the person who gets her off of Jakku. So any conflict between Rey and Kylo, her loyalty to Finn as the person who's the only family she'll ever have should be emphasized above and beyond how she felt about Han.

@snufkin

Plus, if we take out that whole "father figure" line maybe people would be more receptive to Reylo I can't count how many times I have read something like, "But Kylo killed her father figurrrrrre"

@adamdrivershair

I saw Han's role in Rey's life as more of a mentor than a father figure.  Perhaps Rey feels so much abandonment issues at hand that she'll look for that type of role in literally anyone, even someone she's known for two days, and that's the message?  Still...

What gets me though is the line that "Kylo killed Rey's father figure!!!"

Aren't they absolutely missing that fact that Kylo actually killed his OWN father, and are wondering just what in the heck that means, and how that can affect HIM?!?!  Then again, these are probably the same ones that disregard Kylo as a direct descendant of Anakin Skywalker for purely misogynistic reasons (he can't carry the Skywalker name from his mother's side, etc.)

This is just one of those things where the outside world and nostalgia dictate the story: Han means a lot to the fans, so he must mean a lot to Rey regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

I can't even see Han as a mentor figure, because what did he really teach her? If anything she showed him up by fixing Millennium Falcon better than he did. In return, he gives her the gun and tells her that she has a lot to learn, but it doesn't really mean anything.

As for Kylo, I feel like I can't blame people too much for seeing him as Han's murderer rather than his son, because the movie gave them so little of the father/son relationship and the only scene Han and Kylo share is the patricide scene.

Saracene wrote:This is just one of those things where the outside world and nostalgia dictate the story: Han means a lot to the fans, so he must mean a lot to Rey regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

I can't even see Han as a mentor figure, because what did he really teach her? If anything she showed him up by fixing Millennium Falcon better than he did. In return, he gives her the gun and tells her that she has a lot to learn, but it doesn't really mean anything.

As for Kylo, I feel like I can't blame people too much for seeing him as Han's murderer rather than his son, because the movie gave them so little of the father/son relationship and the only scene Han and Kylo share is the patricide scene.

@Saracene

I always felt that it would have been better if Han had taught Rey how to fly the Millennium Falcon instead of her being an expert pilot right from the start. That way Han being Rey's mentor/father figure would have made more sense. It also would have fit nicely with Rey inheriting the Falcon from Han at the end of the film.

Lucina wrote:

Saracene wrote:This is just one of those things where the outside world and nostalgia dictate the story: Han means a lot to the fans, so he must mean a lot to Rey regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

I can't even see Han as a mentor figure, because what did he really teach her? If anything she showed him up by fixing Millennium Falcon better than he did. In return, he gives her the gun and tells her that she has a lot to learn, but it doesn't really mean anything.

As for Kylo, I feel like I can't blame people too much for seeing him as Han's murderer rather than his son, because the movie gave them so little of the father/son relationship and the only scene Han and Kylo share is the patricide scene.

@Saracene

I always felt that it would have been better if Han had taught Rey how to fly the Millennium Falcon instead of her being an expert pilot right from the start. That way Han being Rey's mentor/father figure would have made more sense. It also would have fit nicely with Rey inheriting the Falcon from Han at the end of the film.

@Lucina

I think they used Rey's expertise with Falcon as a way for her to quickly win over Han in the short amount of time they have together. Without it, there's really no reason for him to care about this complete stranger. The idea is not to establish a meaningful relationship, but for an old loved character to like the new one (so that the audience like her too!) Otherwise, in order to give that relationship real substance, you'd need to rewrite the movie.

Saracene wrote:

Lucina wrote:

Saracene wrote:This is just one of those things where the outside world and nostalgia dictate the story: Han means a lot to the fans, so he must mean a lot to Rey regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

I can't even see Han as a mentor figure, because what did he really teach her? If anything she showed him up by fixing Millennium Falcon better than he did. In return, he gives her the gun and tells her that she has a lot to learn, but it doesn't really mean anything.

As for Kylo, I feel like I can't blame people too much for seeing him as Han's murderer rather than his son, because the movie gave them so little of the father/son relationship and the only scene Han and Kylo share is the patricide scene.

@Saracene

I always felt that it would have been better if Han had taught Rey how to fly the Millennium Falcon instead of her being an expert pilot right from the start. That way Han being Rey's mentor/father figure would have made more sense. It also would have fit nicely with Rey inheriting the Falcon from Han at the end of the film.

@Lucina

I think they used Rey's expertise with Falcon as a way for her to quickly win over Han in the short amount of time they have together. Without it, there's really no reason for him to care about this complete stranger. The idea is not to establish a meaningful relationship, but for an old loved character to like the new one (so that the audience like her too!) Otherwise, in order to give that relationship real substance, you'd need to rewrite the movie.

@Saracene

True, I guess this was the intention of the filmmakers. But I also feel that some moments in the film fell flat because the film didn't really take the time to develop relationships between characters in a meaningful way.

I'm watching TFA now, again (think it's 5th time)

and it became even more obvious how Kylo tries do less harm!
why is he so obsessed to find BB-8, find Luke? all his actions, all his anger in the first part of the movie is about it - find Luke,
because if they wouldn't find Luke they use weapon an destroy planets. even that Hax's line "Careful Ren, that your personal interest not interfere with orders from Leader Snoke" is about that.

And then with Snoke Kylo's motives became understandable, why he tried so hard to find Luke, in the novel it's more underlined:


so Kylo really is kind of protagonist even in TFA

Anakin Skywalker wrote:I'm watching TFA now, again (think it's 5th time)

and it became even more obvious how Kylo tries do less harm!
why is he so obsessed to find BB-8, find Luke? all his actions, all his anger in the first part of the movie is about it - find Luke,
because if they wouldn't find Luke they use weapon an destroy planets. even that Hax's line "Careful Ren, that your personal interest not interfere with orders from Leader Snoke" is about that.

And then with Snoke Kylo's motives became understandable, why he tried so hard to find Luke, in the novel it's more underlined:


so Kylo really is kind of protagonist even in TFA

@Anakin Skywalker

It kills me that there are still those who argue he was directly responsible for the destruction of the Hosnian System and potentially the Illinois System as its crystal clear he wanted to no part of it. I was having an argument about it the other day with a fan boy friend of mine who made that same statement. I said, next time you watch it, watch how Kylo turns to Hux and tilts his head. Even when masked, his body language is apparent. As he stands onboard the Finalizer watching it happen, you can see the sadness. In Bloodlines you learn that's where he grew up for crying outloud.

He may have even been the one to send Leia the data card warning her the Illeenium System would be next.

IoJovi wrote:

the Hosnian System and potentially the Illinois System

@IoJovi

As someone who lives in the Midwest, I appreciated this

adamdrivershair wrote:

IoJovi wrote:

the Hosnian System and potentially the Illinois System

@IoJovi

As someone who lives in the Midwest, I appreciated this

@adamdrivershair

I am literally LAUGHING OUT LOUD UPROARIOUSLY right now.  I had no idea my phone autocorrected Illeenium to Illinois until this moment.




Even better is the fact that I have company at the moment...

(I did grow up in Michigan, so I'm Midwest born and raised as well...)

Saracene wrote:This is just one of those things where the outside world and nostalgia dictate the story: Han means a lot to the fans, so he must mean a lot to Rey regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

I can't even see Han as a mentor figure, because what did he really teach her? If anything she showed him up by fixing Millennium Falcon better than he did. In return, he gives her the gun and tells her that she has a lot to learn, but it doesn't really mean anything.

As for Kylo, I feel like I can't blame people too much for seeing him as Han's murderer rather than his son, because the movie gave them so little of the father/son relationship and the only scene Han and Kylo share is the patricide scene.

@Saracene

When it comes to Rey and Finn. Especially meeting Rey. Han needed to trust her and fixing MF was one way to go and they wanted to portray Rey as the really independent woman who is a geek into this. Besides as othes have said, Rey would be someone who would latch on any kinda of meaningful bond, when she was waiting for her family to come to her. Same with Finn and Chewie. She seeks belonging and it is ahead of her. Finding her new family.

I don't blame them as JJ for not giving them more scenes because Kylo was obviously angry atHanand left them to join FO and the Dark Side. They needed Han to meet Leia, Rey and Finn before Kylo. That's what makes their scene really touching. One scene convinced me of their broken bond. Kudos to Harrison Ford and Adam Driver because they look like they could pass for a father and son.

Maybe flashback would do wonders but then we have two more movies and Kylo will struggle with his patricide and Rey will see him as a young kid. I would like to see some happy memory for Kylo being shown for example on MF and how he used to be there with Chewie and Han.

Edit: Sorry I was trying to copy the post and I posted it again

DarthRen wrote:

Saracene wrote:This is just one of those things where the outside world and nostalgia dictate the story: Han means a lot to the fans, so he must mean a lot to Rey regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

I can't even see Han as a mentor figure, because what did he really teach her? If anything she showed him up by fixing Millennium Falcon better than he did. In return, he gives her the gun and tells her that she has a lot to learn, but it doesn't really mean anything.

As for Kylo, I feel like I can't blame people too much for seeing him as Han's murderer rather than his son, because the movie gave them so little of the father/son relationship and the only scene Han and Kylo share is the patricide scene.

@Saracene

When it comes to Rey and Finn. Especially meeting Rey. Han needed to trust her and fixing MF was one way to go and they wanted to portray Rey as the really independent woman who is a geek into this. Besides as othes have said, Rey would be someone who would latch on any kinda of meaningful bond, when she was waiting for her family to come to her. Same with Finn and Chewie. She seeks belonging  and it is ahead of her. Finding her new family.

I don't blame them as JJ for not giving them more scenes because Kylo was obviously angry atHanand left them to join FO and the Dark Side. They needed Han to meet Leia, Rey and Finn before Kylo. That's what makes their scene really touching. One scene convinced me of their broken bond. Kudos to Harrison Ford and Adam Driver because they look like they could pass for a father and son.

Maybe flashback would do wonders but then we have two more movies and Kylo will struggle with his patricide and Rey will see him as a young kid. I would like to see some happy memory for Kylo being shown for example on MF and how he used to be there with Chewie and Han.

@DarthRen

It's not a flashback, but there's a deleted scene of Kylo coming in the MF after it crashed on Starkiller Base. It's also mentioned in the book:
"...his eyes taking every corner of the crashed vessel, looking for-he wasn't sure. Something recognizable, perhaps. There was nothing in the deserted cockpit, but he delayed leaving anyway, settling down in the pilot's seat. Something..."

I really wish they would've left this part in the movie! To me it spoke volumes of his character and how badly he considered leaving with Han.

nite0wl29 wrote:

DarthRen wrote:

Saracene wrote:This is just one of those things where the outside world and nostalgia dictate the story: Han means a lot to the fans, so he must mean a lot to Rey regardless of whether it makes sense or not.

I can't even see Han as a mentor figure, because what did he really teach her? If anything she showed him up by fixing Millennium Falcon better than he did. In return, he gives her the gun and tells her that she has a lot to learn, but it doesn't really mean anything.

As for Kylo, I feel like I can't blame people too much for seeing him as Han's murderer rather than his son, because the movie gave them so little of the father/son relationship and the only scene Han and Kylo share is the patricide scene.

@Saracene

When it comes to Rey and Finn. Especially meeting Rey. Han needed to trust her and fixing MF was one way to go and they wanted to portray Rey as the really independent woman who is a geek into this. Besides as othes have said, Rey would be someone who would latch on any kinda of meaningful bond, when she was waiting for her family to come to her. Same with Finn and Chewie. She seeks belonging  and it is ahead of her. Finding her new family.

I don't blame them as JJ for not giving them more scenes because Kylo was obviously angry atHanand left them to join FO and the Dark Side. They needed Han to meet Leia, Rey and Finn before Kylo. That's what makes their scene really touching. One scene convinced me of their broken bond. Kudos to Harrison Ford and Adam Driver because they look like they could pass for a father and son.

Maybe flashback would do wonders but then we have two more movies and Kylo will struggle with his patricide and Rey will see him as a young kid. I would like to see some happy memory for Kylo being shown for example on MF and how he used to be there with Chewie and Han.

@DarthRen

It's not a flashback, but there's a deleted scene of Kylo coming in the MF after it crashed on Starkiller Base. It's also mentioned in the book:
"...his eyes taking every corner of the crashed vessel, looking for-he wasn't sure. Something recognizable, perhaps. There was nothing in the deserted cockpit, but he delayed leaving anyway, settling down in the pilot's seat. Something..."

I really wish they would've left this part in the movie! To me it spoke volumes of his character and how badly he considered leaving with Han.

@nite0wl29

That or flashback to young Ben and Han but I guess we'll get that in TLJ or maybe in Episode IX. Just to show us their bond or lack of it. They didn't do much to show us that in TFA and hence why criticism.

nite0wl29 wrote:I really wish they would've left this part in the movie! To me it spoke volumes of his character and how badly he considered leaving with Han.

@nite0wl29

That's just it - it speaks too loudly of his character, too soon. The message this scene had will be somehow expressed in VIII in a different (or perhaps similar?) scene. Just look how many are still thinking he's going down Anakin's path, the exact opposite happening eventually should make for a nice plot twist/surprise element.

Italian release date for The Last Jedi is December 13th!!! YAAAAAAASSSSSS!!!!

Maria Antonietta wrote:Italian release date for The Last Jedi is December 13th!!! YAAAAAAASSSSSS!!!!

@Maria Antonietta

So Italians get it on 13t or on 12 after certain hours? cause American release date is 15 but we actually get it on 14 at 7 pm.

vaderito wrote:

Maria Antonietta wrote:Italian release date for The Last Jedi is December 13th!!! YAAAAAAASSSSSS!!!!

@Maria Antonietta

So Italians get it on 13t or on 12 after certain hours? cause American release date is 15 but we actually get it on 14 at 7 pm.

@vaderito

Maybe in big cities, like Milan or Rome. I don't think I will watch it on midnight around here

Maria Antonietta wrote:

vaderito wrote:

Maria Antonietta wrote:Italian release date for The Last Jedi is December 13th!!! YAAAAAAASSSSSS!!!!

@Maria Antonietta

So Italians get it on 13t or on 12 after certain hours? cause American release date is 15 but we actually get it on 14 at 7 pm.

@vaderito

Maybe in big cities, like Milan or Rome. I don't think I will watch it on midnight around here

@Maria Antonietta

13 is still earlier than 14 especially with European time zone. We will need a spoilerific report!

Rimfaxe96 wrote:

nite0wl29 wrote:I really wish they would've left this part in the movie! To me it spoke volumes of his character and how badly he considered leaving with Han.

@nite0wl29

That's just it - it speaks too loudly of his character, too soon. The message this scene had will be somehow expressed in VIII in a different (or perhaps similar?) scene. Just look how many are still thinking he's going down Anakin's path, the exact opposite happening eventually should make for a nice plot twist/surprise element.

@Rimfaxe96

Yea I agree! i never put 2/2 together until I read the book and watched the movie again. *lightbulb*! Moment on my end there

Maria Antonietta wrote:Italian release date for The Last Jedi is December 13th!!! YAAAAAAASSSSSS!!!!

@Maria Antonietta

13th here as well!!!

Just came back from the cinema to find this wonderful news I'll repeat the morning screening experience of RO, for sure.