ARCHIVE: The Last Jedi: General Discussion - 1

MeadowofAshes wrote:

Rogue Rey wrote:

MeadowofAshes wrote:@Rogue Rey You definitely have homework to do!! They are from Knights of the Old Republic which is now EU. Google their images and see if they remind you of anyone...

Oh yeah totally seeing it

And they have a Force Bond. And they are a Jedi/Sith couple.

The amount of similarities between Reylo and Revan and Bastila is too obvious, in the art concept they even make Kylo's mask look like Revan's mask and that somewhat confirm that not only they did acknowledge the character but also may be borrow stuffs from his story. Just think, if they stick with the Revan-liked mask, EU fan would be screaming that Reylo are the Revan and Bastila on screen

Sylvia Snow wrote:

MeadowofAshes wrote:

Rogue Rey wrote:

MeadowofAshes wrote:@Rogue Rey You definitely have homework to do!! They are from Knights of the Old Republic which is now EU. Google their images and see if they remind you of anyone...

Oh yeah totally seeing it

And they have a Force Bond. And they are a Jedi/Sith couple.

The amount of similarities between Reylo and Revan and Bastila is too obvious, in the art concept they even make Kylo's mask look like Revan's mask and that somewhat confirm that not only they did acknowledge the character but also may be borrow stuffs from his story. Just think, if they stick with the Revan-liked mask, EU fan would be screaming that Reylo are the Revan and Bastila on screen

Yeah except with a happier ending.

First wanted to say hello. I am here too!!! A bit busy with Easter so not much time. Not sure yet in which thread to post. Need to check them all and see which ones are more of interest to me. Quickly screening through the posts here, seems to be one for me. So let's start :-)

Training in VIII:
I have my doubts that we will see much training. As mentioned in the let's-avoid-to-name-it discussion thread I was a bit taken aback by the short discussion between Leia and Rey at the end of the adult novelization. It really sounded like there was a bigger plan that Rey's training at hand and that it was linked with Ben. The scene is not in the movie so we can debate on whether the intent is still there in the movie. Still I don't see how there is time for Rey to be fully trained. Maybe a quick training with the main training postponed, but never taking place because Kylo would have to train her out of necessity - if they're stuck together alone somewhere, which is an idea I quite like. I would see neither of them being happy about it - Rey because she thinks he's a monstah and Kylo because he's sore that she refused his proposal in such a dramatic way. I think there are quite a few of us that expect some snarling in the Han/Leia style.

Revan/Bastila
I just purchased the novel "Star Wars The Old Republic - Revan". Need to read it. Honestly I tried for years to not fall into the Star Wars pit where you buy books and merchandize and all. And damn Kylo just sent me right into this pit. I blame JJ and most of all Adam Driver. So far, I only read the prologue and I was already seeing Kylo in the description. Long dark shoulder length hair, being unsure of who he is (hero or villain) and where he belongs... Honestly, I know barely anything about Revan / Bastila, but since seeing pictures and reading a summary of their stories, it's very difficult to not see the parallels. So yeah, maybe a bit too obvious (?)

SanghaRen wrote:First wanted to say hello. I am here too!!! A bit busy with Easter so not much time. Not sure yet in which thread to post. Need to check them all and see which ones are more of interest to me. Quickly screening through the posts here, seems to be one for me. So let's start :-)

Training in VIII:
I have my doubts that we will see much training. As mentioned in the let's-avoid-to-name-it discussion thread I was a bit taken aback by the short discussion between Leia and Rey at the end of the adult novelization. It really sounded like there was a bigger plan that Rey's training at hand and that it was linked with Ben. The scene is not in the movie so we can debate on whether the intent is still there in the movie. Still I don't see how there is time for Rey to be fully trained. Maybe a quick training with the main training postponed, but never taking place because Kylo would have to train her out of necessity - if they're stuck together alone somewhere, which is an idea I quite like. I would see neither of them being happy about it - Rey because she thinks he's a monstah and Kylo because he's sore that she refused his proposal in such a dramatic way. I think there are quite a few of us that expect some snarling in the Han/Leia style.

Revan/Bastila
I just purchased the novel "Star Wars The Old Republic - Revan". Need to read it. Honestly I tried for years to not fall into the Star Wars pit where you buy books and merchandize and all. And damn Kylo just sent me right into this pit. I blame JJ and most of all Adam Driver. So far, I only read the prologue and I was already seeing Kylo in the description. Long dark shoulder length hair, being unsure of who he is (hero or villain) and where he belongs... Honestly, I know barely anything about Revan / Bastila, but since seeing pictures and reading a summary of their stories, it's very difficult to not see the parallels. So yeah, maybe a bit too obvious (?)

Welcome!! Glad you made it over!!!

I really like the idea of them being stuck together and having to work with one another to find a resolution or escape. I can totally see Adam Driver pulling off a massive sulk - not a tantrum, but an actual arms crossed pouting sulk. Which would of course really rile Rey and then you get the Han/Leia bickering - edging closer and closer (like Han and Leia) and before you know it something happens and I don't mean kiss, just a fleeting/passing moment.

Yeah I've got to check out Revan/Bastila too - I got my homework assigned last night

Rogue Rey wrote:

SanghaRen wrote:First wanted to say hello. I am here too!!! A bit busy with Easter so not much time. Not sure yet in which thread to post. Need to check them all and see which ones are more of interest to me. Quickly screening through the posts here, seems to be one for me. So let's start :-)

Training in VIII:
I have my doubts that we will see much training. As mentioned in the let's-avoid-to-name-it discussion thread I was a bit taken aback by the short discussion between Leia and Rey at the end of the adult novelization. It really sounded like there was a bigger plan that Rey's training at hand and that it was linked with Ben. The scene is not in the movie so we can debate on whether the intent is still there in the movie. Still I don't see how there is time for Rey to be fully trained. Maybe a quick training with the main training postponed, but never taking place because Kylo would have to train her out of necessity - if they're stuck together alone somewhere, which is an idea I quite like. I would see neither of them being happy about it - Rey because she thinks he's a monstah and Kylo because he's sore that she refused his proposal in such a dramatic way. I think there are quite a few of us that expect some snarling in the Han/Leia style.

Revan/Bastila
I just purchased the novel "Star Wars The Old Republic - Revan". Need to read it. Honestly I tried for years to not fall into the Star Wars pit where you buy books and merchandize and all. And damn Kylo just sent me right into this pit. I blame JJ and most of all Adam Driver. So far, I only read the prologue and I was already seeing Kylo in the description. Long dark shoulder length hair, being unsure of who he is (hero or villain) and where he belongs... Honestly, I know barely anything about Revan / Bastila, but since seeing pictures and reading a summary of their stories, it's very difficult to not see the parallels. So yeah, maybe a bit too obvious (?)

Welcome!! Glad you made it over!!!

I really like the idea of them being stuck together and having to work with one another to find a resolution or escape.  I can totally see Adam Driver pulling off a massive sulk - not a tantrum, but an actual arms crossed pouting sulk.  Which would of course really rile Rey and then you get the Han/Leia bickering - edging closer and closer (like Han and Leia) and before you know it something happens and I don't mean kiss, just a fleeting/passing moment.

Yeah I've got to check out Revan/Bastila too - I got my homework assigned last night

Almost kiss or eye contact that lasts a little too long, maybe a lingering touch. Yeah, the Han/Leia snark will be strong with these two once they get somewhat comfortable. I can see him being amused by his own wit too and she's just kind of exasperated (*PST* but really she likes it *PST*). I anticipate while it won't directly happen in the next film, we'll have no doubt by the end these two are gonna get nasty. Jedi in the streets, Sith in the sheets.

I wonder about the Knights of Ren and how big their role will be. I am torn between the idea of them having an important role and just having them in limited scenes due to the already high number of main to medium characters. I would tend on the second option and them adding to kickassery of fighting scenes. I am really curious about Kylo's relationship with them. Given that he is prone to tantrums like a 5 years old, one wonders how he can be their master. I see them as a bunch of crazy guys/girls with a common goal. I think there are theories that they are jedi relic hunters and that they follow Kylo because he's the grandson of Vader and maybe because he is strong with the Force. I have not seen any leak so far on their role or actors / actresses playing KOR members.

IMHO, the Knights of Ren have to have been created for a reason. They are, perhaps, there so that Kylo can turn against them in a dramatic rescue scene? Because otherwise, I'm afraid Hux is going to have to be the noble sacrifice in VIII. And . . . poor Millicent!

SanghaRen wrote:I wonder about the Knights of Ren and how big their role will be. I am torn between the idea of them having an important role and just having them in limited scenes due to the already high number of main to medium characters. I would tend on the second option and them adding to kickassery of fighting scenes. I am really curious about Kylo's relationship with them. Given that he is prone to tantrums like a 5 years old, one wonders how he can be their master. I see them as a bunch of crazy guys/girls with a common goal. I think there are theories that they are jedi relic hunters and that they follow Kylo because he's the grandson of Vader and maybe because he is strong with the Force. I have not seen any leak so far on their role or actors / actresses playing KOR members.

I've been wondering about the KOR as well. I'm currently inclined to think that we'll actually see very little of them, and that they're not followers of Ren, as such. I imagine them as an order of warrior monks, and as in any order of monks, I imagine the Master of the Knights of Ren is - like other Priors and Commanders of that kind - nominated by an external power (like Snoke).

AnneNeville wrote:IMHO, the Knights of Ren have to have been created for a reason. They are, perhaps, there so that Kylo can turn against them in a dramatic rescue scene? Because otherwise, I'm afraid Hux is going to have to be the noble sacrifice in VIII. And . . . poor Millicent!

At the same time I could see the KOR turning with Kylo and help the Resistance as a group that does the dirty job when needed. Ok, maybe this does not sound like Star Wars anymore

Hux will be sacrificed, I tell you. Hell, I want to see this nasty "first boy in the row of the school class" go down the drain. That would be deeply satisfying Kylo could adopt Millicent and they could purr together. Wouldn't it be funny if they put Millicent in a frame, just maybe its tail as an Easter egg.

SanghaRen wrote:I wonder about the Knights of Ren and how big their role will be. I am torn between the idea of them having an important role and just having them in limited scenes due to the already high number of main to medium characters. I would tend on the second option and them adding to kickassery of fighting scenes. I am really curious about Kylo's relationship with them. Given that he is prone to tantrums like a 5 years old, one wonders how he can be their master. I see them as a bunch of crazy guys/girls with a common goal. I think there are theories that they are jedi relic hunters and that they follow Kylo because he's the grandson of Vader and maybe because he is strong with the Force. I have not seen any leak so far on their role or actors / actresses playing KOR members.

Yeah, I've heard the same rumors. Ive also heard they possibly 'worship' Vader, or at least aspire to follow his cause (whatever that actually is). Pablo Hidalgo recently answered a tweet where he said there's nothing to suggest the KOR are force sensitive, but "it's too early to say" or something. Some people seem ro think that means LF hasn't decided whether the KOR will be FS types, but I think whether they are or not is already decided (narratively speaking). So, Pablo's answer is just a non-answer because based on what we've seen in the TFA he's right, there's nothing to suggest the KOR are FS, but it's too early to tell.

I know their weapons appear to be powered by red Kyber crystals, so that's interesting. Also, they apparently existed before Kylo joined them.

SanghaRen wrote:

AnneNeville wrote:IMHO, the Knights of Ren have to have been created for a reason. They are, perhaps, there so that Kylo can turn against them in a dramatic rescue scene? Because otherwise, I'm afraid Hux is going to have to be the noble sacrifice in VIII. And . . . poor Millicent!

At the same time I could see the KOR turning with Kylo and help the Resistance as a group that does the dirty job when needed. Ok, maybe this does not sound like Star Wars anymore

Hux will be sacrificed, I tell you. Hell, I want to see this nasty "first boy in the row of the school class" go down the drain. That would be deeply satisfying Kylo could adopt Millicent and they could purr together. Wouldn't it be funny if they put Millicent in a frame, just maybe its tail as an Easter egg.

The KOR are really curious - such an unknown commodity that I'm really looking forward to seeing how they play out.

Yeah Kylo can adopt Millicent and they can sit there together like that scene in James Bond with the baddie and the cat in the chair. AD meowing at the orange cat is Oscar Isaac's arms in Inside Llewyn Davis is just too special.

Today I had this idea. Not sure if already mentioned. What if we get to revisit Vader's history or what we think we know. Kylo mentions that he will finish what Vader started. I always thought it was setting order in the Galaxy - there is a part in the adult novelization when Kylo talks about order. But it could well be that Vader was searching for something in the Jedi Temple and now Kylo is looking for it too.

Maybe it's even a way to set peace in the Galaxy. Probably Luke also searches for it or already found it but cannot use it. What is weird is that Snoke does not seem interested in finding the Jedi Temple. Or he does not want Kylo to get there because he and Rey are the ones meant to unlock whatever is in there.

I heard that TFA didn't do as well in the Asian market as Disney/LF were expecting or would have liked. Now I believe from various posts in the old thread - that there is a big interest/demand in dark romances between hero's/villains etc in that market.

So if they want to crack the lucrative Asian market then having a hero/villain romance in VIII (even if it's under-developed or more hinted at) might be the way forward, and so far we have seen that they've laid the foundations - they're just building the walls with VIII.

I'm only speculating.

This is a great instagram account and they posted some behind the scenes photos of TFA.
In this one I think it is Adam and not his double? Anyway he has a black glove on his right hand. It may be to get used to wearing a glove but wonder if Kylo will have/has a robotic arm?

http://iconosquare.com/p/1217631399593317413_2144766988

SanghaRen wrote:Today I had this idea. Not sure if already mentioned. What if we get to revisit Vader's history or what we think we know. Kylo mentions that he will finish what Vader started. I always thought it was setting order in the Galaxy - there is a part in the adult novelization when Kylo talks about order. But it could well be that Vader was searching for something in the Jedi Temple and now Kylo is looking for it too.

Maybe it's even a way to set peace in the Galaxy. Probably Luke also searches for it or already found it but cannot use it. What is weird is that Snoke does not seem interested in finding the Jedi Temple. Or he does not want Kylo to get there because he and Rey are the ones meant to unlock whatever is in there.

This, to me, would explain why the First Order was able to recover part of the map from the archives of the Empire, if Vader was already looking for the Jedi Temple.

What I would lovee to see happen is KOR/Kylo vs Rey and Luke. I basically want a complete ripoff from the old republic video game stuff. Rey as Satele Shan with badass double lightsaber moves. Also it would be ahhmazing if Williams used Duel of the Fates or music from Anakin vs Obi Wan. I would explode from happiness and crazy high blood pressure.

That being said, doubt something this epic will happen. I agree that Rey will probably not be trained to such a high level in the next movie. By the third yes, but by then hopefully she sees Kylo more as an ally. I think it would be super cool if she did end up getting trained partially by Kylo. Would be quite ironic. And hot. lol

ReyofLightSide wrote:This is a great instagram account and they posted some behind the scenes photos of TFA.
In this one I think it is Adam and not his double? Anyway he has a black glove on his right hand. It may be to get used to wearing a glove but wonder if Kylo will have/has a robotic arm?

http://iconosquare.com/p/1217631399593317413_2144766988

If they were rehearsing, he probably wore the glove to simulate the quality of grip that he'd have on the saber in the actual scene. That would the the smart thing to do. Finn didn't have gloves, so no need for John to rehearse with them. What's on his shoulder? A huge bruise?

While I absolutely love the idea of Kylo Ren teaching/training Rey at some point (how hot would that be?), part of me can't get the image out of my mind of another movie that explored a young woman's sexual awakening via her older, more worldly teacher...  



I just have this image of Ren trying to correct Rey's lightsaber form, and Rey giggling because he's touched a ticklish spot.

ISeeAnIsland wrote:While I absolutely love the idea of Kylo Ren teaching/training Rey at some point (how hot would that be?), part of me can't get the image out of my mind of another movie that explored a young woman's sexual awakening via her older, more worldly teacher...  

I just have this image of Ren trying to correct Rey's lightsaber form, and Rey giggling because he's touched a ticklish spot.

It would be preeety crazy for them to not do a heated reylo fight training scene. When you have two badasses training together....it's obvious you gotta go for that. They did that recently in Agents of Shield and Divergent also had. Soo tense. Wooh!

AnneNeville wrote:

ReyofLightSide wrote:This is a great instagram account and they posted some behind the scenes photos of TFA.
In this one I think it is Adam and not his double? Anyway he has a black glove on his right hand. It may be to get used to wearing a glove but wonder if Kylo will have/has a robotic arm?

http://iconosquare.com/p/1217631399593317413_2144766988

If they were rehearsing, he probably wore the glove to simulate the quality of grip that he'd have on the saber in the actual scene. That would the the smart thing to do. Finn didn't have gloves, so no need for John to rehearse with them. What's on his shoulder? A huge bruise?

The 'bruise' is a makeup appliance for the wound Kylo sports on his upper arm during certain stages of the saber duel.
The upper arm of his costume was sliced open by a saber cut by Finn and the makeup simulates a large gash underneath.
It is clearly seen during certain moments later in the duel, and still shots from the set.



And yes, Adam is wearing one of Kylo's costume gloves during the rehearsal scene above.
It is to insure he knows what kind of grip he needs to exert to properly hold the saber stick during 'battle' to avoid it slipping out of position.
Very smart indeed.
Thats our boy..!

Just been reading this article about Rian Johnson and what we should/can expect from him as director of VIII:

http://www.denofgeek.com/movies/rian-johnson/39727/star-wars-episode-8-what-can-we-expect-from-rian-johnsons-film

Complex characters who go through the ringer and a darker tone! But we already know from John and Daisy that VIII is a darker feel, but an interesting read all the same.

Here is my speculation for Episode VIII....

Act I

1. Luke isn't happy to see Rey and refuses to leave the island. Rey sticks around trying to persuade him to return.
2. Finn has recovered and befriends resistance members including KMT's character.
3. Kylo is training with the KOR and seems more evil. He is wearing a mask.
4. Leia leaves the resistance base to attend a funeral for the Hosnian victims and for Han. She goes to gather support from surviving members of the republic against the FO.
5. Rey has dreams/visions of Kylo and one vision of the FO attacking some place and Leia being in danger. Snoke sends Kylo and Hux on a mission to finish off the resistance and surviving republic leaders, including Leia.
6. Luke and Rey immediately leave the island and head for this place, and contact Finn/Poe to tell them of the danger. Everybody rushes to save Leia.

Act II

1. The funeral is taking place on the beach and some people gather at a nearby building to discuss the future, including Leia.
2. There is a bomb blast in town. The resistance has just arrived and Finn and KMT use a space horse to warn the resistance leaders that the FO have arrived.
3. The FO launches an attack, both in the building and on the beach.
4. Luke and Rey reach the place and they split up. The resistance also arrives and a big fight begins.
5. We discover that Luke is immensely powerful and repels the FO in the building while trying to reach Leia. Rey is on the beach, surrounded by the injured and dead, and fighting the KOR.
6. The KOR corner Rey and one almost kills her. Kylo unexpectedly steps in and kills the knight. He seizes Rey and leaves.
7. Luke reaches Leia but she is seriously injured and he blames himself for not being there for his family.
8. The resistance has suffered severe losses in the fight and Rey is missing.
9. Finn, KMT and other resistance members are captured by Phasma and co.

Act III

1. Kylo has escaped with Rey alone. She hates him even more. We finally get to see his face and the scar. Rey tried to escape, sabotages the star ship and they get stranded somewhere, possibly some dangerous tropical jungle.
2. Then we learn Kylo's backstory. Facing dangers together, we see the beginnings of romance. Kylo also teaches Rey to develop her FS skills and as a result is again conflicted between light and dark.
3. Leia is in a coma. The resistance is in shambles. Poe and some of his people approach Laura Dern's character for help. She refuses because she doesn't like the resistance. Poe, in desperation, takes over the ship and heads to rescue Finn and the others.
4 Luke is trying to rally support and locates Lando with Maz's help. Lando agrees to help.
5. Phasma tortures Finn and wants to get him re-programmed. Rey senses Finn and her friends are in danger. She convinces a reluctant Kylo to help her reach them.
6. Rey and Kylo arrive and there is a huge fight. They free Finn and the others, and are almost captured again...but Poe and his people arrive to save the day. In the confusion, Rey gets captured by the KOR...and when Kylo tries to ask the resistance for help to save Rey, he gets captured by them with Luke's help.
7. Episode VIII ends with both Rey and Kylo as prisoners on different sides...Luke comes to visit an angry Kylo...and Rey is taken to see Snoke. We are left wondering what happened to Leia.


[I am going with the idea that Luke's students tried to kill a teenage Kylo when they found out he was Vader's grandson....Luke was away at the time the news spread...... Snoke got into his head like he did to Rey in Episode VII (but pretending to be Vader) and told him to kill them. Kylo blamed his parents for sending him away, he blamed Luke for not being there when he was in danger.....goaded by Snoke, in a rage, he killed his attackers and in the skirmish the jedi temple also burned down. He tried to fly back home but when he reached, he found that he was being blamed by his parents for the incident and felt he had nowhere to go. So he goes to Snoke and the FO. But this is where there is a twist...he doesn't like either the resistance or the FO. He is on a rogue mission to kill Snoke (since he has already destroyed the new jedi order)....the way his grandfather destroyed both jedi and sith...and he believes he is helping the galaxy in this way. Then we find out he never wanted to kill Han but had to do it to prove his loyalty to Snoke etc....and the ashes belong to the jedi students who tried to kill him....as a reminder to trust nobody.]

@panki

You have put a lot of thought in it. I think the "stranded together somewhere" for Rey and Kylo is a typical Reylo shipper's head canon If we don't get that, we'll be highly disappointed. I was also thinking about an end where Kylo is a prisoner of the Resistance, but I was thinking of him giving himself in and the audience would be left wondering if it's a trick. I have a hard time envisioning a powerful force user being held in captivity against his will by non force users. I guess, I compare it to Superman. How do you contain a force user? Unless he's hurt but that would be redundant. Or there is some force blocking material that can be used.

The only thing missing is Benicio Del Toro. And not a lot of Snoke. And I'd like that Jedi Temple to be important and to reveal something big about the Force. And instead of looking for holes in your scenario, I should start making my own scenario

SanghaRen wrote:@panki

You have put a lot of thought in it. I think the "stranded together somewhere" for Rey and Kylo is a typical Reylo shipper's head canon If we don't get that, we'll be highly disappointed. I was also thinking about an end where Kylo is a prisoner of the Resistance, but I was thinking of him giving himself in and the audience would be left wondering if it's a trick. I have a hard time envisioning a powerful force user being held in captivity against his will by non force users. I guess, I compare it to Superman. How do you contain a force user? Unless he's hurt but that would be redundant. Or there is some force blocking material that can be used.

The only thing missing is Benicio Del Toro. And not a lot of Snoke. And I'd like that Jedi Temple to be important and to reveal something big about the Force. And instead of looking for holes in your scenario, I should start making my own scenario

@SanghaRen

I am almost certain a couple will be stranded in episode 8....in the PT, it was Anakin and Padme on Naboo...and in the OT, it was Han and Leia on the asteroid belt.....it could still be Finn and KMT, but the potential of Rey and kylo being stranded and him actually teaching her the ways of the force made more sense to me....making his remark during their last fight a little prophetic

I like your idea of him surrendering to the resistance....that could keep the audience wondering what to expect....the reason I thought Luke would subdue him was to show the extent of Luke's powers and it gives the opportunity for a confrontation between Luke and Kylo.....the earlier it happens, the better the chances of Kylo's redemption...if it happens at the end of episode 9, it is not a good sign for kylo

My heart wants Benicio Del Toro's character to be Ezra Bridger...but he could be a bad guy KOR or FO officer....or maybe a bounty hunter who helps the resistance....I didn't mention him because I can see multiple scenarios for him.....
I feel we'll see less of Snoke because he will be the focus of episode 9...though we might learn more about his identity in episode 8 from Kylo.

I'm looking forward to reading what you feel might happen....esp. about the jedi incident and the force.

@panki Is there any way for Kylo and Rey to get stranded together and have to work together that does not involve him upping his "evil quotient" by kidnapping her a second time? What are your thoughts?