Re: Episode IX CRACK spoiler discussion thread

[Casey Kanata]

@Kylo Rey. Del Toro was said to be cast for Episode VIII by various news outlets, way back in Spring 2015

[Piper Maru]

Hahahaha Reylo Baby? Sign me up. That would be the ultimate F-YOU to the fanboy community.

By the way, I don't think it's impossible that this guy saw something. Yes, a lot of things from his TLJ leak were different, but I do think he had access to concepts/pages of the first treatment – Canto Bight and certain elements of Rey and Kylo's interaction. From the first treatment to the final product a lot of things change, sometimes drastically (remember TFA's early script with Luke's floating hand and the early concept of Jedi Killer eating suns?).

[special_cases]

Well, I don't know, guys... I'm sure this person doesn't know full plot and lies about some things but he\she guessed too much last time. And they didn't edit their post in the past - and it was posted December 22, 2015.

Also, remember that then Reylo was very very unpopular and ReySky was... you know. And he guessed this and almost nobody believed it in December 2017!

Kylo murders Snoke, having known all along Snoke was aiming to replace him before he grew powerful enough to overtake him, and declares himself ruler of the First Order.

[Night Huntress]

if you want to have a really good time- go back and read the "leaks" and "rumors" about TLJ - most of them are really hilarious!

You can argue that some got a few things right...BUT almost every possible outcome was explored in one way or the other so... - imo it was a combination of putting together location/filming/storyboard leaks and lucky guesses.

It's fun reading this kind of leaks- we have a long time of waiting ahead of us...so all rumors are welcome at this point even if they end up be completely nonsense.

[loversinthestorm]

Honestly, this plot looks very bizarre, but the then I remember that Jack Thorne is writing IX and I start to wonder... Secret babies and a "fanfic like" stories it's kind of what I expect from him after CC

[Kylo Rey]

Hahahaha Reylo Baby? Sign me up. That would be the ultimate F-YOU to the fanboy community.

By the way, I don't think it's impossible that this guy saw something. Yes, a lot of things from his TLJ leak were different, but I do think he had access to concepts/pages of the first treatment – Canto Bight and certain elements of Rey and Kylo's interaction. From the first treatment to the final product a lot of things change, sometimes drastically (remember TFA's early script with Luke's floating hand and the early concept of Jedi Killer eating suns?).

@Piper Maru

The thing is, Rian has said that his first to last treatment didn't change much at all. The biggest change we know of was Finn and Rose going to Canto Bight instead of Finn and Poe. One of the producers also said that they were surprised when Rian handed his final treatment in because there were such little changes, as blockbusters usually have tons of rewrites. The TFA situation is different I feel. That was a more rocky production with Michael Arndt originally working on it then JJ & Kasdan coming in. As it was the first movie and they were setting up new characters, stories, and an entire trilogy, it stands to reason that they were playing around with a lot of ideas in concept art. Once that is all hammered down and you have to do the sequel, you have less space to work with. JJ was even changing the story along the way e.g. when Harrison Ford broke his leg and they had to stop production which gave him more time to work on the script.

@special_cases It's also possible that even if he did get a few details correct, he's using it to boost his credibility and doesn't actually have anything this time round so he's making everything up. A lot of leakers do that. Very few people would have seen the storyboard at this point, especially as it seems they were completed recently, so it would be easy for Disney to track down this person.

@loversinthestorm Jack Thorne isn't working on it anymore, he left a while back. It's JJ and Terrio cowriting.

[special_cases]

@Night Huntress Yeah, but this leak is unique. TFA's premiere was 14 Dec and he posted it 22 Dec. Wow, he was very lucky with such guesses among ReySky, Finnrey and Snoke is Big Bad.

[Night Huntress]

Well, I don't know, guys... I'm sure this person doesn't know full plot and lies about some things but he\she guessed too much last time. And they didn't edit their post in the past - and it was posted December 22, 2015.

Also, remember that then Reylo was very very unpopular and ReySky was... you know. And he guessed this and almost nobody believed it in December 2017!

Kylo murders Snoke, having known all along Snoke was aiming to replace him before he grew powerful enough to overtake him, and declares himself ruler of the First Order.

@special_cases

OK, let's take a closer look - just for the fun of it:

- Luke tells Rey what happened during the fall of his academy. - right - not hard to guess though

- Kylo Ren is growing in power. He possesses a skill for manipulating the force that has never been seen. Snoke senses this and aims to replace Kylo with Rey, and plans to use Kylo to do it. - wrong

- Luke trains Rey in the ways of the Force. well partly right

- Rey confronts the spiritual test of the darkness within herself. very vague- with much much fantasy this could be the cave scene

- Kylo murders Snoke, having known all along Snoke was aiming to replace him before he grew powerful enough to overtake him, and declares himself ruler of the First Order. There is a slight rift among the troopers in whether they will follow Kylo or Hux. right more or less

- Rey leaves against Luke's wishes to confront Kylo. The B plot of the story is what drives her out. right

now the funny parts:

- Kylo Ren and Rey fight again. There is an underlying sense of attraction between the two. Kylo Ren is much, much stronger than he was in their last fight. He beats Rey and reveals he spared her life in the temple purge and left her on Jakku. He again beckons her to join him. This time, the result of that offer is left up in the air. wrong

- Captain Phasma has placed a substantial bounty on Finn's head. maybe? but it's not in the movie

- She and Hux are relentlessly searching the Galaxy for the Resistance. wrong

- They find the Resistance base and decimate it with an impressive land assault. could be Crait but still..

- Finn and Poe meet a refugee and the three of them spend most of the story evading bounty hunters and the First Order. wrong

- Finn falls for the refugee. Head over heels. wrong

- On a planet that's essentially the Las Vegas of the Galaxy, the refugee turns on Finn and Poe and collects the bounty on their heads.
They are captured and tortured on this planet. wrong

- It's here that Rey and Kylo fight. wrong

- Finn manages an escape but Poe is captured and sent to what is essentially maximum security for the First Order.
That's the first treatment. wrong

Other tidbits include the mention that the Galaxy is absolutely war torn right now with no leadership and many systems just fending for themselves.
not explored in the movie

Del Toro will play a bounty hunter. nope

Luke refuses to join the fight on either side. This upsets Leia wrong

Kylo Ren will kill an officer for mentioning the scar on his face. wrong

[special_cases]

@Night Huntress I know what is wrong with leak, I read it 50+ times while waiting for TLJ lol but it's undeniable that he guessed the most unbelievable things in 8 days after TFA's premiere. Comparing to leaks from November 2017 this guy was very close to the main ideas in the film and got wrong details about these ideas.

[MeadowofAshes]

As much money as I'd pay to see the Renperor Reylo Love Child , TLJ purposely built toward then subverted a kiss 3 times. They're building the dramatic tension toward a kiss in IX. So... Rey and Kylo have a love child without having their first big kiss on screen?

No, I buy a kid, but I buy a kid at the end of the movie as a "And they lived happily ever after."

[nickandnora]

Best guesses are that this guy is a plant from the studio itself controlling leaks (mixing real and false pieces of information that are completely out of context), or he's someone who's seen the storyboards and doesn't understand the context at all, OR he's a lower level employee who thinks he has a reliable source and is feeling important about it, when really he's being super-duped in the long run (as several of you have said, Rey Palpatine really, really smacks of "leak trap" to me.)

@special_cases This person also got many things about TLJ laughably wrong, and his (her?) insistence that he didn't is weird, almost like he didn't actually watch the final version of TLJ himself to confirm, lol.

[Irina de France]

@Night Huntress Well, looking at what the leaker got right, apart from Renperor (but some sections of the fandom actually wanted that), a lot of it is kind of in Captain Obvious territory? Luke training Rey? Didn't *really* happen, but everyone expected that. Rey confronting the darkness within herself? ESB callback, and a lot of fake leaks back in early 2016 were more or less ESB copy-pastes. So I'm very doubtful about how legit this leaker is. He may have seen something or it could be lucky guesses, but secret love child? Come on. The secret love child in Love Never Dies made more sense, and this is coming from someone who thinks that musical is the worst musical ever made (and I've seen the Broadway production of Tanz der Vampire, guys.)

[Night Huntress]

@Night Huntress I know what is wrong with leak, I read it 50+ times while waiting for TLJ lol but it's undeniable that he guessed the most unbelievable things in 8 days after TFA's premiere. Comparing to leaks from November 2017 this guy was very close to the main ideas in the film and got wrong details about these ideas.

@special_cases

That's the only twist he or she got right though- everything else was either easy to guess /vague or wrong.

Not saying he/she didn't had a source that somehow got this information - and I admit I have no idea how pre-production works and how much of it can leak this easily and fast...so who knows.  

[rawpowah]

If he were the real deal, it's kind of suspicious the Mouse didn't get to him like he got to Bothan Spy.

[special_cases]

@nickandnora Well, I don't see "laughably wrong" things in his leak. Even "Luke refuses to join the fight on either side" is kind of right idea for two acts in TLJ and it was definitely shocking for people while they were watching TLJ. Laughably wrong in our fandom is My baby gurl and Snoke is Prime Jedi for me.

But I can believe in him being a plant from studio and he certainly doesn't understand some context. I have said already that I don't think that he got all this information from storyboards or whatever - maybe just some details.

Most people called Pawn's leak a total nonsense. Some leakers just don't get full context and don't know how to report facts, not their personal interpretation.

[Darth Dingbat]

The thing is, that TLJ "leak" makes more sense if you reduce it to some visuals that the person might have really seen, and then embellished and imagined the rest.

Let's say for the sake of an argument that he saw some pieces of concept art. He may have seen art of:

-  a casino planet
- Poe in Canto Bight prison (as it was Poe and Finn who originally went there)
- new female character (in fact Rose, but became "refugee girl" in his own imagination)
- some art hinting at romance between Finn and this new female character
- Kylo killing Snoke
- Phasma and Hux handing the credits to DJ (hence => DJ as bounty hunter)
- Kylo "beckoning" at Rey to join him
- Kylo as Supreme Leader
- FO's "impressive land assault" on the Resistance base

Not saying he's real. But Finn and Poe's adventure on a Las Vegas planet is an example of a really lucky guess for December 2015. The casino planet only became a staple in the fake leaks after Dubrovnik became common knowledge, and even then there was no certainty whether it was actually a casino planet.

Likewise - again, assuming the person really has seen something - the new "leak" might be reduced to possible visuals he has seen. For example:

- ocean planet
- new alien female character
- Reylo Force bond
- Rey holding a child, presumed to be hers
- Rey's ragtag band of Force users

etc.

[nickandnora]

@Night Huntress I know what is wrong with leak, I read it 50+ times while waiting for TLJ lol but it's undeniable that he guessed the most unbelievable things in 8 days after TFA's premiere. Comparing to leaks from November 2017 this guy was very close to the main ideas in the film and got wrong details about these ideas.

@special_cases

That's the only twist he or she got right though- everything else was either easy to guess /vague or wrong.

Not saying he/she didn't had a source that somehow got this information - and I admit I have no idea how pre-production works and how much of it can leak this easily and fast...so who knows.  

@Night Huntress

Well, I mean I assume people in pre-production have information about the plot. They have to actually make the film, so people need to know things about it for it to get made. So yeah, I don't have a problem believing there are people out there who know things.

It's this person's attitude that has me confused in an offhand kind of way. There's this weird, resolute insistence that they are absolutely correct, and while he/she tries to reconcile the inconsistencies in the early leaks given, the explanations don't make total sense either. It's like this person is purposely being dishonest (plant) or is prideful to the point of delusion. *shrug*

[special_cases]

@Night Huntress I know what is wrong with leak, I read it 50+ times while waiting for TLJ lol but it's undeniable that he guessed the most unbelievable things in 8 days after TFA's premiere. Comparing to leaks from November 2017 this guy was very close to the main ideas in the film and got wrong details about these ideas.

@special_cases

That's the only twist he or she got right though- everything else was either easy to guess /vague or wrong.

Not saying he/she didn't had a source that somehow got this information - and I admit I have no idea how pre-production works and how much of it can leak this easily and fast...so who knows.  

@Night Huntress

No, sorry, "attraction between Rey and Kylo", "Kylo kills Snoke and becomes the Supreme Leader", "Kylo wants to rule the Galaxy together" and even "the result of that offer is left up in the air" (Rey said nothing, so mabe he knew only about one part of this scene), "Rey is Not Related", "Finn falls for another girl" , "Las Vegas in Space" and "Luke doesn't want to join the fight" really weren't easy to guess in December 2015.

And I personally don't see how this is vague because it is main plot points. And I have never seen them together in one leak for two years pre-TLJ. The main plot point he got wrong was Rey\Kylo fight and Rey in Jedi Temple, everything else is irrelevant. Yes, Rian said that he didn't change script too much after first draft and all these important plot points stayed and if the B-plot changed some B-characters storylines - that's not important rewrite. Also, Rian himself said in "The Director and the Jedi" that he changed a few things right before the filming started which kind of confirmed the rumors about changing the opening scenes in the movie (from Finn to Poe).

[rawpowah]

@special_cases Moving already established scenes around isn't the same as changing entire storylines (he claims Rey was part of Luke's academy when Kylo destroyed it and Kylo dumped her on Jakku, and he claimed Rey and Kylo fought against each other when in fact the Rey and Kylo team up was the first thing Rian envisioned for the movie). Then there are also his claims that LF is abandoning the trilogy format, which goes against everything Rian, JJ and KK have said.

[MeadowofAshes]

@Night Huntress I know what is wrong with leak, I read it 50+ times while waiting for TLJ lol but it's undeniable that he guessed the most unbelievable things in 8 days after TFA's premiere. Comparing to leaks from November 2017 this guy was very close to the main ideas in the film and got wrong details about these ideas.

@special_cases

That's the only twist he or she got right though- everything else was either easy to guess /vague or wrong.

Not saying he/she didn't had a source that somehow got this information - and I admit I have no idea how pre-production works and how much of it can leak this easily and fast...so who knows.  

@Night Huntress

No, sorry, "attraction between Rey and Kylo", "Kylo kills Snoke and becomes the Supreme Leader", "Kylo wants to rule the Galaxy together" and even "the result of that offer is left up in the air" (Rey said nothing, so mabe he knew only about one part of this scene), "Rey is Not Related", "Finn falls for another girl" , "Las Vegas in Space" and "Luke doesn't want to join the fight" really weren't easy to guess in December 2015.

And I personally don't see how this is vague because it is main plot points. And I have never seen them together in one leak for two years pre-TLJ. The main plot point he got wrong was Rey\Kylo fight and Rey in Jedi Temple, everything else is irrelevant. Yes, Rian said that he didn't change script too much after first draft and all these important plot points stayed and if the B-plot changed some B-characters storylines - that's not important rewrite. Also, Rian himself said in "The Director and the Jedi" that he changed a few things right before the filming started which kind of confirmed the rumors about changing the opening scenes in the movie (from Finn to Poe).

@special_cases

Our entire website and podcasting community was predicated on the first bolded point -- it's literally in TFA. The rest of the bolded are definitely easy to guess as possibilities for plot points if one understands plot structure, foreshadowing, and dramatic tension. They were possibilities discussed in this community early on.

[special_cases]

@Night Huntress I know what is wrong with leak, I read it 50+ times while waiting for TLJ lol but it's undeniable that he guessed the most unbelievable things in 8 days after TFA's premiere. Comparing to leaks from November 2017 this guy was very close to the main ideas in the film and got wrong details about these ideas.

@special_cases

That's the only twist he or she got right though- everything else was either easy to guess /vague or wrong.

Not saying he/she didn't had a source that somehow got this information - and I admit I have no idea how pre-production works and how much of it can leak this easily and fast...so who knows.  

@Night Huntress

No, sorry, "attraction between Rey and Kylo", "Kylo kills Snoke and becomes the Supreme Leader", "Kylo wants to rule the Galaxy together" and even "the result of that offer is left up in the air" (Rey said nothing, so mabe he knew only about one part of this scene), "Rey is Not Related", "Finn falls for another girl" , "Las Vegas in Space" and "Luke doesn't want to join the fight" really weren't easy to guess in December 2015.

And I personally don't see how this is vague because it is main plot points. And I have never seen them together in one leak for two years pre-TLJ. The main plot point he got wrong was Rey\Kylo fight and Rey in Jedi Temple, everything else is irrelevant. Yes, Rian said that he didn't change script too much after first draft and all these important plot points stayed and if the B-plot changed some B-characters storylines - that's not important rewrite. Also, Rian himself said in "The Director and the Jedi" that he changed a few things right before the filming started which kind of confirmed the rumors about changing the opening scenes in the movie (from Finn to Poe).

@special_cases

Our entire website and podcasting community was predicated on the first bolded point -- it's literally in TFA. The rest of the bolded are definitely easy to guess as possibilities for plot points if one understands plot structure, foreshadowing, and dramatic tension. They were possibilities discussed in this community early on.

@MeadowofAshes

Can you show an example of prediction when one theory included all these points? Because I have never seen such theory. Especially with Kylo being Supreme Leader and Finn's new love interest in 2015? Yeah, Rey\Kylo attraction is easy to guess but even Reylos weren't sure about everything before Databank's update. Also, I don't think that all bolded points are really that easy to guess, I see Reylo theorists more as an exception in community considering everything you have said about plot structure and foreshadowing. While a lot of predictions were made by community of people, he\she made it alone in 8 days after watching TFA - without possibility to see it on Blu-Ray.

Edit: This leaker needs to pay me a salary, I'm kind of his PR manager right now

[Riri]

So i did some comment-digging because I wanted to see how people reacted to his TLJ leak. Its interesting, people just werent having it when he posted it a week after TFA released.

The leaker being adament that Kylo falls in love with Rey and becomes Supreme Leader


People calling Reylo incest (however leaker seems sure she has a famous last name but not related to Kylo)




Snoke death reaction

[Darth_Awakened]

I think it's very likely that every leak or a part of it that contains "x or y wants this or that"is fake, because it's almost impossible to "read" the character's motivations from the things like concept art.

[nickandnora]

As a sidenote about these "spoilers"... keeping in mind that I'm just a person, and have absolutely no inside info about anything one way or another... my best, most logical guess about this "child" that seems to have evolved into a Reylo lovechild out of probable context confusion or storyboard misunderstanding (or completely fake information) is that he/she is part of a vision or flashback that is essentially the reveal of the future Rey saw when she touched Kylo's hand.

ie. She saw some sort of vision during the hut scene that indicated a family, including a wife and child, and perhaps as the film goes on and her feelings for Kylo progress, she begins to self-substitute into said vision (to whatever extent she wasn't already subconsciously projecting herself into it already).

That might account for the "NO THEY HAD A LOVECHILD TOGETHER" insistence that, frankly, out of everything this person has said, makes the least amount of sense, story-wise (at least in the way this leaker is saying).

[rawpowah]

Where is it specified that he posted his leaks in 2015 & 8 days after TFA? All I see is "2 years ago" and since it's 2018, that would mean 2016?

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