Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors

Still disappointing.

Ok I agree with @snufkin ( am not gonna lose faith over this ) and am not gonna panic about it . I don’t think it’s a flashback scene because the mask has been mended to look “ corrupted” and unstable , so it wouldn’t look like that ( Jason says it’s like cross between Vader and Darth Maul the effect as it’s welded together ) so it’s probably a scene where he is ruling the first order but I can’t honestly believe JJ Abrams would waste Adam so for now am gonna believe it’s maybe one scene and nothing more ( probably at the beginning - maybe even an
Opening scene ...).

Well, I see it as Kylo needing to look entirely 'bad' as Supreme Leader in order to emphasize that his current path is not the right one to be on, at all. Although he seemed to be caught in the middle in TLJ, let's not forget that by the end of the film he ultimately chose the wrong side. This is the last film, so I'm assuming he'll lose the mask for true when he turns back into Ben Solo.

The idea that Kylo would put on a mask again after Snoke cruelly mocked him for being a child in a mask in TLJ is weird to me. But I'm going to reserve judgement. Before TLJ came out I was very sceptical about Kylo destroying his mask early on, but it happened, for completely plausible reasons.

I think that, even if the mask is on again, Episode IX will follow the pattern of TFA and TLJ and have the majority of Kylo's interactions with Rey maskless (I think that's one of the reasons Rian had the mask removed so early on). I'd also guess that most of these interactions will happen in the second half, and Rey and Kylo might not see much of each other in the first.

That dude on reddit who first leaked #maskgate confirmed KOR too!

“ They did show numerous pictures/artwork of them. I wish I had more details but at the very least it seems like they will play a bigger role than previous films. While I'm a star wars fan, I'm not a superfan like many of you so a lot of names/details/places probably were wasted on someone like me. “
https://www.reddit.com/r/StarWarsCantina/comments/a2jvw1/more_info_spoiler/?st=JP814OY0&sh=015497ea

Also this tweet i saw:

“Y’all do realize in typical Byronic hero storytelling the character usually doubles down and falls harder after that first setback, right? So I’m all for the mask, and let the next time he takes it off be not in anger, but for some kind of inner peace.”

Honestly if KOR are back, it makes sense for Kylo to also have a mask!

Sorry double post.

Putting this here because apparently the OP has been confirmed to work as an extra


You want a leak?
u/Hufflepuffins
“Episode IX is about to film scenes which involve a great deal of smoke and atmos effects at Pinewood. They're using SPACT performers with experience in firearms and sword fighting. They'll be expected to wear masks. 4 days filming.“

https://www.reddit.com/r/StarWarsLeaks/comments/a2gdz3/you_want_a_leak/?st=JP81Z1EP&sh=736b53b4

I kind of excited to see Kylo in broken mask. He cau use a mask anytime he isn't with Rey or Leia. I think it can go like this: as Supreme Leader he is always with hidden face but in more private moments he doesn't put it on. When FO falls and Kylo is Ben then almost nobody in the Galaxy will know who he is.

I kind of enjoy how Driver plays Kylo just with his body and voice. He is brilliant.

That sounds like a Mustafar or a KoR scene (smoke and swords).

Does he have any Reylo scoops?

So the idea is that Kylo actually wears his old smashed mask?

Random FO underling: "The Supreme Leader wants the mask repaired by Tuesday."

Blacksmith: *gulp*

@Saracene

Sources have said they saw Kylo Ren with the reforged mask on in various stages of dress, which also means we can’t yet say how often he wears the helmet, so if this news disappoints you, try to keep that in mind.. To them it looked like the mask was pieced back together using some kind of red crystalline bonding material. The visual gave the mask “a very corrupted look.” A little Kylo, a little Vader, and maybe even with a hint of Maul’s facial stylings.

Also I think that LFL is the one who shared these spoilers.

So disappointing. Various stages of dress means multiple scenes. *sigh*

Hi all so the plot thickens as they say because according to those links above - they take us back to another leaker ( week’s ago posted in crack spoilers I think ) who leaked they were an extra in a scene where Hux gets captured by the resistance but more interestingly is he says this about Hux and Matt Smith ( and it brings back memories regarding how they said Matt Smith’s role would be pivotal ):


[SPOILERS] episode 9 set leak description - will not post on the other sub reddit for some reason
https://www.reddit.com/r/starwarsspeculation/comments/9z9i8x/spoilers_episode_9_set_leak_description_will_not/?st=JP84C2D1&sh=4d47a30e




Maybe this should stay in crack spoilers. We shall
See ......,

@AhsokaTano I'm sorry can you explain why these leaks connected?

@Special_cases
Hi ya - if you go into the leak about the guy talking about how he was at a Disney marketing meeting ( one posted above and that I posted in crack spoilers yesterday from Reddit ) someone else mentions the above leaker have just mentioned in my latest post above as also mentioning this same new droid previously and so I then went into his posts via the thread and found the stuff about Matt Smith and Hux ( and him claiming to
Be an extra ) . It could be trash of course but two /three things have come out of this that seem
To be certain - new droid , kylo’s mask
And knights of Ren for episode 9.
Some info
https://www.reddit.com/r/StarWarsLeaks/comments/a24dyj/some_info/?st=JP86E9SZ&sh=eb0dba8e

Follow the thread in leak above
It’s probably nothing anyway

Saracene wrote:The idea that Kylo would put on a mask again after Snoke cruelly mocked him for being a child in a mask in TLJ is weird to me. But I'm going to reserve judgement. Before TLJ came out I was very sceptical about Kylo destroying his mask early on, but it happened, for completely plausible reasons.

I think that, even if the mask is on again, Episode IX will follow the pattern of TFA and TLJ and have the majority of Kylo's interactions with Rey maskless (I think that's one of the reasons Rian had the mask removed so early on). I'd also guess that most of these interactions will happen in the second half, and Rey and Kylo might not see much of each other in the first.

@Saracene

I think it wouldn't be a stretch for him to wear the mask again. With Snoke out of his head and used to being manipulated and told what to do, it would be a self-inflicted, in that he would be punishing himself and also not letting his emotions tell those around him what he is thinking/feeling.

If the rumours end up being true about the design of the mask, the cracks are literally showing.

@Starliteprism
Well put ! The cracks are indeed showing . I would be more concerned if it was a new mask but welding the old one together to make it look unstable /corrupted just reminds us ( like his lightsaber) that he isn’t as firmly rooted to his life as Kylo Ren and the darkside as he thinks he is .If these leaks are true I wonder if the kylo
Comic before episode 9 will be like the phasma one ie how he got his mask out of the trash compactor and put it back together lol! ( just kidding ).

rawpowah wrote:So disappointing. Various stages of dress means multiple scenes. *sigh*

@rawpowah

Starliteprism wrote:

Saracene wrote:The idea that Kylo would put on a mask again after Snoke cruelly mocked him for being a child in a mask in TLJ is weird to me. But I'm going to reserve judgement. Before TLJ came out I was very sceptical about Kylo destroying his mask early on, but it happened, for completely plausible reasons.

I think that, even if the mask is on again, Episode IX will follow the pattern of TFA and TLJ and have the majority of Kylo's interactions with Rey maskless (I think that's one of the reasons Rian had the mask removed so early on). I'd also guess that most of these interactions will happen in the second half, and Rey and Kylo might not see much of each other in the first.

@Saracene

I think it wouldn't be a stretch for him to wear the mask again. With Snoke out of his head and used to being manipulated and told what to do, it would be a self-inflicted, in that he would be punishing himself and also not letting his emotions tell those around him what he is thinking/feeling.

If the rumours end up being true about the design of the mask, the cracks are literally showing.

@Starliteprism

That makes sense... I am just praying that Adam does get multiple scenes without that stupid mask.

Should we call this the mask gate? lol

Repeatish from what I posted in the crack thread -

I think this is toy related because it is far to early for movie marketing with outside vendors.  I am not certain of the reason why, yet toys do not always align with the movie.  Or, they place emphasis on looks, which are only featured for a small (sometimes insignificant) time in the movie.

They do plan a bit ahead because I recall that John Campea was having an open mic talk about Avengers:IW, and his wife Ann joined him.  She is a project leader/director for Hasbro.  The subject came up about Captain Marvel and her powers, and she said she cannot really say too much because of what she knows....but she can say a general thing featured in the comics (and she proceeded with that info).  Captain Marvel is released March 19, and that was April 2018...Ann gave an indication this was being worked on for a bit...so...could very well have been slightly over a year, which is about this timeframe.  

The fact that there are leaks from this meeting indicates to me it is toy company related because I cannot imagine anyone directly with Disney or LF saying anything (ultimately, who is in charge of the teaser trailer that will be seen at Celebration, and even for that - it's probably too early to begin creating it - they are still filming. They may be working on the teaser poster now, but...I think it's too early to be seen by an outside party - and if it is, it's stylized/out of context).  With toys, they have to reach outside about now.

tukicarreno wrote:

rawpowah wrote:So disappointing. Various stages of dress means multiple scenes. *sigh*

@rawpowah

Starliteprism wrote:

Saracene wrote:The idea that Kylo would put on a mask again after Snoke cruelly mocked him for being a child in a mask in TLJ is weird to me. But I'm going to reserve judgement. Before TLJ came out I was very sceptical about Kylo destroying his mask early on, but it happened, for completely plausible reasons.

I think that, even if the mask is on again, Episode IX will follow the pattern of TFA and TLJ and have the majority of Kylo's interactions with Rey maskless (I think that's one of the reasons Rian had the mask removed so early on). I'd also guess that most of these interactions will happen in the second half, and Rey and Kylo might not see much of each other in the first.

@Saracene

I think it wouldn't be a stretch for him to wear the mask again. With Snoke out of his head and used to being manipulated and told what to do, it would be a self-inflicted, in that he would be punishing himself and also not letting his emotions tell those around him what he is thinking/feeling.

If the rumours end up being true about the design of the mask, the cracks are literally showing.

@Starliteprism

That makes sense... I am just praying that Adam does get multiple scenes with that stupid mask.

Should we call this the mask gate? lol

@tukicarreno

Another gate, still a year to go T_T

From the Reddit Spoiler wrote:
Naomi Ackie is here as Veranada (Vera) Calrissian. There is no mention of a formal leader but they seem to be more in leadership roles.

WHOA. Has this been put out there before? She's Lando's daughter?

I wouldn't worry about the mask thing. As far as I remember, last time MSW only had a few minor sources and the supposed "leaks" they did have turned out completely different in the actual film, e.g. the Rey/Kylo/Luke confrontation. It definitely looks like IX is heavily guarded, perhaps the most out of all three because it's the endgame. It's literally impossible to know anything for certain with still a year to go, especially anything related to climactic scenes. Whatever rumour exist, they most likely refer to earlier/less important portions of the film.

I have no doubts we'll see Ben's face for all the important scenes with Rey, etc. It cannot be any other way after what they shared and how deeply they got to know one another. He is a human being to her now rather than a monster and not just that, but someone important to her. Even if he does wear a mask again, it'll have some plot relevance, e.g. he might wear it when he's with the KOR, as a means of hiding his true emotions as he does, it's very possible he might be trying to play the role of the menacing Supreme Leader to trick others and, most of all, himself into thinking he is too far gone and doesn't have any other choice at this point. It being cracked (if true) is quite significant, same as the cracked saber in a metaphorical sense. A symbol of Ben's own cracked soul. I'm even imagining a moment where Rey's like "Take it off! I want to see your face! Look at me, Ben!", sth dramatic like that. xD Anyway, who knows if it's even true, but even if it is, he won't wear it for very long. After all, this is the movie where Ben Solo will find himself again and make his choice for good. We all know redemption is coming, his suffering and torment will finally come to an end. Adam will nail it once again!

For all we know, Disney is making more masked Kylo toys solely because they sell, not because of a plot point, because much like Vader before him, the scary black mask is popular, and somebody just assumed that meant he has it back on in IX. Seriously, all the filmmakers thus far have known when the mask is appropriate and when it's not. Really, we're all acting as if the guy in currently in charge of IX didn't make these characters in TFA or decide on the symbolic nature of the mask and the fact that it is very much a facade.

The cracked mask would be especially fitting, like he's trying to be the big bad SL, when really people can see right through him. It would make a cool visual too. I like the KoR idea from TFA as well. There are ways the movie can do this cleverly and fittingly, since he did sort of regress at the end of TLJ into making very dumb decisions. That's if they do this at all, which I'm still not convinced of. It's really freaking out and losing all hope of a good movie or satisfying character arc and interactions over nothing. Come on guys.

The primary advantage I see to going back to the mask is it will make it easier for Ben to go mostly unrecognized as the former Kylo Ren.

Kylo Ren was basically a faceless monster (and from the open of TFA the First Order seems big on their troopers remaining masked unless they have permission to remove their helmets). Only a handful of people in TFA saw Kylo without his mask. A number of people did in TLJ, but compared to the First Order as a whole, it was a pittance and no one outside the First Order save Rey, Finn and Chewie have seen more than distant glimpses of him without his mask.

So presuming he immediately went back to the mask before going public as Supreme Leader, you’ve got three main people who could identity Ben Solo as Kylo Ren by sight in the Resistance and say a hundred or so in the First Order (nearly all of whom only know him as Kylo Ren and have no idea he used to be Ben) who could do the same. I don’t think we’ve had any confirmation beyond Lor San Tekka (close confidant of Luke) that anyone other than Luke, Han, Leia, Chewie, Finn and Rey that Ben and Kylo being the same person is widely known.

In other words, the mask gives them a loophole to give Ben Solo a more normal life once he is redeemed (instead of a lifetime of imprisonment and/or exile). If he’s truly redeemed then he’d devote the rest of his life to try and make up for his past regardless of if the galaxy at large holds him accountable... the galaxy at large believing Kylo Ren to be dead and Ben Solo to be someone else though gives much more latitude to future stories as to how Ben goes about earning his redemption (while also answering why he wasn’t executed for war crimes).

Even more solid would be if the actual villain of IX actually replaces Kylo with an impostor behind the mask. Then some combo of the impostor being publicly unmasked and/or Ben helping Rey fight the impostor in the Kylo mask with others as witnesses creates more than reasonable belief that Kylo Ren and Ben Solo were never the same person. The audience knows better of course, but the audience also knows Ben’s going to spend the rest of his life atoning for what he’s done too, so it’s easier for the audience to give him a pass than for the people actually living in the galaxy.

Another fun aspect of Star Wars’ time jump/en media res opens is that you could actually open the film with Kylo having already been replaced. Rey has been basically ignoring all Ben’s ForceSkype requests for the past year so she doesn’t realize the monster behind the mask committing atrocities isn’t Ben. Then she finally meets “Kylo Ren” face to face and realizes his presence in the Force is all wrong (or he pulls off his mask and we see Matt Smith’s face and not Adam Driver’s)... that it’s not Ben under the mask at all. Queue Rey then reaching out to Ben with the Force and learning he’s been inprisoned/marooned/whatever and has been trying to get in touch with her all this time to let her know and to get her help so he can make it right.

Not saying that would happen, but it’d be a very interesting way to use the default Star Wars formula and general perceptions to actually subvert the audiences’ expectations. “You thought Kylo had become a complete monster. SURPRISE!!!”

rawpowah wrote:So disappointing. Various stages of dress means multiple scenes. *sigh*

@rawpowah

Actually it could just mean they were deciding which scenes it looked best in, though I am now laughing thinking of him wearing it while shirtless w/ his high waist pants!!

As far as the mask goes, I really don't understand the dismay over it.... JJ started Reylo in TFA w/ Kylo wearing a mask. Him wearing it again doesn't signal no redemption or no romance with Rey. Also the leaker added more about it's look; "It definitely looked like it was broken and put back together with the red stuff. The lines were kinda thin. It kinda reminded me of the look of a porcelain vase that was broken and put back together if that makes sense."

When I first heard of it honestly I was excited, because it sounds like Kintsugi...
"The kintsugi technique suggests many things. We shouldn’t throw away broken objects. When an object breaks, it doesn’t mean that it is no more useful. Its breakages can become valuable. We should try to repair things because sometimes in doing so we obtain more valuable objects. This is the essence of resilience. Each of us should look for a way to cope with traumatic events in a positive way, learn from negative experiences, take the best from them and convince ourselves that exactly these experiences make each person unique, precious."
https://www.lifegate.com/people/lifestyle/kintsugi
"This repair method celebrates each artifact’s unique history by emphasizing its fractures and breaks instead of hiding or disguising them. Kintsugi often makes the repaired piece even more beautiful than the original, revitalizing it with new life."
& "Namely, the practice is related to the Japanese philosophy of wabi-sabi, which calls for seeing beauty in the flawed or imperfect. The repair method was also born from the Japanese feeling of mottainai, which expresses regret when something is wasted, as well as mushin, the acceptance of change."
https://mymodernmet.com/kintsugi-kintsukuroi/
A Christian piece about Kintsugi & Redemption: http://kinstugi.blogspot.com/2015/05/kintsugi-and-power-of-forgiveness-and.html

And:
"There is a Japanese art form called Kintsugi that I think is a beautiful metaphor for this redemptive process. Kintsugi is the process of fixing broken pottery with a lacquer resin sprinkled with powdered gold. The story goes that in the 15th century, the Shogun of Japan sent a damaged Chinese tea bowl to China to be repaired. When it was returned with ugly metal staples, Japanese craftsmen came up with a more aesthetic means of repair. Hence, Kintsugi. Because of the gold linings, the new pottery becomes even more valuable than the old unbroken pottery.

I wonder if the same is true for us. We all experience brokenness, sometimes in very painful ways. But I believe there is also hope for repair, healing, and redemption. If you are a person of faith, perhaps you view God as an integral part of this process. And when the process is complete, the new version of yourself may be even more valuable than the old."
https://www.joshuanhook.com/kintsugi/

LBR this will be Ben as Supreme Leader

As for the leak, the further down you scroll the more incredulous people become with hoping the Mandalorisn character dropped is Rey and being way too eager to validate their KoR fixation. Bonus the # of people who think MSW, they of the “Kylo and the KoR crash land on Ache to” leak who couldn’t speculate their way out of a paper bag, somehow is a trusted third party when Daddy has to play ball with Disney to get that advance preview family pass to Galaxy’s Edge. Nothing that get drops (especially with JJ in charge after what happened before) isn’t what Disney wants you to hear.

And yes, go look in the Archives to see the levels of despair people fell into after that Vanity Fair quote about there being no romance. Or TLJ was barely out and people had to start wailing about Kellogg Ren.