Episode IX: Spoilers and Rumors

SW_Heroine_Journey wrote:

californiagirl wrote:Slightly surprised they revealed Mark, even if most of us were expecting him as an FG. My worry is that people will interpret that as retconning TLJ. No Gwendoline Christie or Andy Serkis. Though if they use him for some kind of flashback, I wouldn't reveal that now either.

I know Carrie's kids had given permission to use archival footage, and they very much wanted her in the film. And so did I. Was never a fan of recasting or CGI, it would have been far too distracting and taken over the conversation. But cutting her out kind of destroys a major part of the story and the characters' arc. I don't think Carrie would want Leia to just die before the movie even starts and just get tossed off to the side like she isn't important to the film, when she completely is, like JJ says. Extra footage always seemed like the most reasonable option.

And the fact they mention Billie in the same lineup of returning cast members makes me think she will get a bigger role.

Also note they claim it's the FINAL installment of the Skywalker saga.

Really everything I want is happening.

@californiagirl

Don't have any worries!  If it heats up, I am certain Mark will tweet something.  In addition, John Campea just had a special live youtube about this, where he accepts superchats - viewing them as a sample, none of them mentioned that - it was all about Force Ghost Luke, and it was based on the "See you around, kid" in TLJ.  

I focused on the mention of "conclusion to the Skywalker saga" - I will not be surprised if, during the teaser and trailer(s), it is verbally said by the trailer announcer voice, or in writing, or both.

@SW_Heroine_Journey

I'm not worried in the least about the phrase "conclusion of the Skywalker saga." 90% of the audience expects Ben to die at this point, just like 90% of the audience expected Luke to be revealed as Rey's father in TLJ. They're not going to give away the real end of the film in a single sentence. If you go by that strategy, it screams the opposite.

Disney also didn't buy the SW Franchise for 5 billion dollars just to end the Skywalker bloodline. It also could be some clever wording, as Ben's last name is Solo. What we probably will get is a satisfying conclusion to Rey and Ben's love story. Then we'll get another installment 10 years from now that revolves around their kids.

IoJovi wrote:

SW_Heroine_Journey wrote:

californiagirl wrote:Slightly surprised they revealed Mark, even if most of us were expecting him as an FG. My worry is that people will interpret that as retconning TLJ. No Gwendoline Christie or Andy Serkis. Though if they use him for some kind of flashback, I wouldn't reveal that now either.

I know Carrie's kids had given permission to use archival footage, and they very much wanted her in the film. And so did I. Was never a fan of recasting or CGI, it would have been far too distracting and taken over the conversation. But cutting her out kind of destroys a major part of the story and the characters' arc. I don't think Carrie would want Leia to just die before the movie even starts and just get tossed off to the side like she isn't important to the film, when she completely is, like JJ says. Extra footage always seemed like the most reasonable option.

And the fact they mention Billie in the same lineup of returning cast members makes me think she will get a bigger role.

Also note they claim it's the FINAL installment of the Skywalker saga.

Really everything I want is happening.

@californiagirl

Don't have any worries!  If it heats up, I am certain Mark will tweet something.  In addition, John Campea just had a special live youtube about this, where he accepts superchats - viewing them as a sample, none of them mentioned that - it was all about Force Ghost Luke, and it was based on the "See you around, kid" in TLJ.  

I focused on the mention of "conclusion to the Skywalker saga" - I will not be surprised if, during the teaser and trailer(s), it is verbally said by the trailer announcer voice, or in writing, or both.

@SW_Heroine_Journey

I'm not worried in the least about the phrase "conclusion of the Skywalker saga." 90% of the audience expects Ben to die at this point, just like 90% of the audience expected Luke to be revealed as Rey's father in TLJ. They're not going to give away the real end of the film in a single sentence. If you go by that strategy, it screams the opposite.

Disney also didn't buy the SW Franchise for 5 billion dollars just to end the Skywalker bloodline. It also could be some clever wording, as Ben's last name is Solo. What we probably will get is a satisfying conclusion to Rey and Ben's love story. Then we'll get another installment 10 years from now that revolves around their kids.

@IoJovi

Hence it will turn in to the Solo Saga

IoJovi wrote:

SW_Heroine_Journey wrote:

californiagirl wrote:Slightly surprised they revealed Mark, even if most of us were expecting him as an FG. My worry is that people will interpret that as retconning TLJ. No Gwendoline Christie or Andy Serkis. Though if they use him for some kind of flashback, I wouldn't reveal that now either.

I know Carrie's kids had given permission to use archival footage, and they very much wanted her in the film. And so did I. Was never a fan of recasting or CGI, it would have been far too distracting and taken over the conversation. But cutting her out kind of destroys a major part of the story and the characters' arc. I don't think Carrie would want Leia to just die before the movie even starts and just get tossed off to the side like she isn't important to the film, when she completely is, like JJ says. Extra footage always seemed like the most reasonable option.

And the fact they mention Billie in the same lineup of returning cast members makes me think she will get a bigger role.

Also note they claim it's the FINAL installment of the Skywalker saga.

Really everything I want is happening.

@californiagirl

Don't have any worries!  If it heats up, I am certain Mark will tweet something.  In addition, John Campea just had a special live youtube about this, where he accepts superchats - viewing them as a sample, none of them mentioned that - it was all about Force Ghost Luke, and it was based on the "See you around, kid" in TLJ.  

I focused on the mention of "conclusion to the Skywalker saga" - I will not be surprised if, during the teaser and trailer(s), it is verbally said by the trailer announcer voice, or in writing, or both.

@SW_Heroine_Journey

I'm not worried in the least about the phrase "conclusion of the Skywalker saga." 90% of the audience expects Ben to die at this point, just like 90% of the audience expected Luke to be revealed as Rey's father in TLJ. They're not going to give away the real end of the film in a single sentence. If you go by that strategy, it screams the opposite.

Disney also didn't buy the SW Franchise for 5 billion dollars just to end the Skywalker bloodline. It also could be some clever wording, as Ben's last name is Solo. What we probably will get is a satisfying conclusion to Rey and Ben's love story. Then we'll get another installment 10 years from now that revolves around their kids.

@IoJovi

There is a thought it is the end due to story structure of the Hero's Journey, trinity with a trinity (a nine-part saga), and also based on verbiage by George Lucas about 9 movies, and Disney/Lucasfilm is honoring that. I agree, BUT I am not attached to it. So, if decades from now, it is decided to return to the Skywalker story because - most likely $, I understand. After IX, I think Disney/Lucasfilm wants to focus on other aspects of the universe/galaxy, apart from the Skywalkers.

Anyway, being of that thought, and if it is important to Lucasfilm/Disney, they may want to emphasize The End...we shall see.

Guys remember the Golden Dice and all the repetition of phrases/themes between Solo and TFA/TLJ, “too much of his father in him?” It’s ending the saga started in the PT with that lineage and going forward be about Solo. Even the dumb “I have no people” bit in Solo (and Rey having no family because her parents abandoned her) point to that. And the dice are a big part of that.

Riri wrote:They forget to mention Adam here LOL

@Riri

I remember when they also forgot to include Daisy and John in the credits of the TLJ DVD lol.

californiagirl wrote:Slightly surprised they revealed Mark, even if most of us were expecting him as an FG. My worry is that people will interpret that as retconning TLJ. No Gwendoline Christie or Andy Serkis. Though if they use him for some kind of flashback, I wouldn't reveal that now either.

I know Carrie's kids had given permission to use archival footage, and they very much wanted her in the film. And so did I. Was never a fan of recasting or CGI, it would have been far too distracting and taken over the conversation. But cutting her out kind of destroys a major part of the story and the characters' arc. I don't think Carrie would want Leia to just die before the movie even starts and just get tossed off to the side like she isn't important to the film, when she completely is, like JJ says. Extra footage always seemed like the most reasonable option.

And the fact they mention Billie in the same lineup of returning cast members makes me think she will get a bigger role.

Also note they claim it's the FINAL installment of the Skywalker saga.

Really everything I want is happening.

@californiagirl

I just hope it's not FINAL final... I want to see Rey & Ben in the future perhaps in another trilogy! Just hope they still leave the door open for that!

Could Naomi and Richard be Vi and Cardinal from the Phasma book?
Bear with me for a moment - Cardinal and Finn together to orchestrate a massive stormtrooper rebellion, and it wouldn't take a massive amount of time to bring the GA up to date on who they were. And neither Vi or Cardinal have any love for the First Order, I don't think. Of course, Cardinal hated Phasma the most, but just a thought.

Lol reuploaded to include Adam and Keri

Riri wrote:Lol reuploaded to include Adam

@Riri

The casting announcement updated to include Keri Russell.

https://www.starwars.com/news/star-wars-episode-ix-cast-announced

Keri

Please JJ, Keri as a straight talking FO officer who has to handle post breakup Kylo

I wonder how big a role Leia could possibly have if they’re using unseen footage of Carrie from VII? Granted, we don’t know how much extra footage there is, but I can’t imagine there’s very much since it’s all unused.

I’m glad Billy Dee Williams was confirmed. It’ll be interesting to see how they incorporate Lando into the story. I’m assuming he’ll be an ally that helps Leia and the Resistance during their time of need.

Since it looks like Phasma is truly gone, at least one of the three new actors will probably be affiliated with the FO. Richard Grant seems to be the obvious pick since he looks a lot like a FO officer, but I hope they defy expectations and it’s actually Keri Russell or Naomi Ackie. Especially since we haven’t really had a female villain in the SW movies yet other than Phasma (who is now gone).

I'm glad to hear there won't be recasting or *shudder* CGI for Leia, both options would feel wrong to me.

Fingers crossed Richard E Grant is playing a FO baddie who conspires with Hux to overthrow Kylo. He'd be marvellous in a sneering villain role.

Saracene wrote:I'm glad to hear there won't be recasting or *shudder* CGI for Leia, both options would feel wrong to me.

If there IS CGI I would expect it to be overlaying Carrie’s scenes with a different background and/or digitally inserting other actors into the shots (ex. putting Adam into a scene in place of Harrison) a la inserting Tom Hanks in Forest Gump.

In fact, one of the most obvious things to be doing right now (and I will as soon as I get home) is to check through TFA’s deleted scenes to see if there are any Leia scenes included in them that might work if the person she’s interacting with were replaced with Adam and/or Daisy. My hunch would be if there were any scenes or alternate takes with Han as those are going to most related to family and/or regrets.

HOW are they going to make the Leia thing work without killing her at some point?   I mean, the lines already recorded can be worked in to IX in a meaningful way? Ahh... Can’t wait to see what capacity she’ll appear in.

Edit: Haters in FB comment sections are already like, “NOOO! They’re gonna kill Lando!” I doubt it

Edit 2: Irrational fears just taking over I guess. There’s no way they’d have Carrie appear only to have Leia die. Hopefully she and Ben can still be reunited somehow I don’t envy their jobs in making it all work.

Wonderful news, guys! I’ve just come back from the cinema after watching a very exhausting film and needed something like this!
Regarding Leia, my favourite option was recasting, but I understand they wanted to honour Carrie Fisher and probably preferred to avoid potential backlash too. I’m glad they haven’t decided to kill her off in the opening crawl, especially if it would be the First Order doing, as this means her character is indeed important for IX - and bendemption! However, just as a few of you have already mentioned, there won’t be much Leia in the movie itself and her scenes probably won’t be much significant either. My guess is that she’ll be used to introduce Lando to the movie and she’ll die for sure too - that would be a great opportunity to show Kylo’s emotional state upon his mother’s death.
And have you seen Adam’s latest pics? Hair getting longer!

Whatever Richard E Grant does, JJ should make better use of him than Stephen Moffat and Lena Dunham did. And there’d better be a Making of Book he writes in the style of With Nails. And louche sleaze is something he can do in his sleep but man he’d be fun with Hux.

Ooooh my I go out for a few hours and come back to this! Wowsers I cannot wait to see how JJ will pull together that old footage - unless as some one pointed out they were scenes with Han. Anyhow I’m super duper happy about KMT and I am astounded about Richard E Grant. Am I glad to be around for this next part of the spoilers train - I’m strapped in ready lol

EDIT Crikey I log in and there’s only 5 registered users and 22 others, news travels fast lol

How exciting today! I confess, while I am happy to hear that Leia will be in the film, I am a bit disappointed that they are using old material. Frankly because her costume in TFA was not my favorite! I know, shallow, right, but it's true! I said it! And so did Carrie Fisher, she called it her 'Sunoco gas station attendant' outfit. That said though, I am happy to hear she isn't getting killed off in the opening crawl. I suspect that she will likely die in this movie though.
Hope that the old material they use is incorporated in a way that looks good. But I'm a big fan of JJ Abrams so I'm sure he will do a great job.
and also... Lando!!! Who else is excited! Hope his part is bigger than just a cameo!

Okay, via Wookiepedia’s list of deleted scenes from the TFA blu-ray here are two likely places some Leia footage (with tweeking) might be pulled from;

1) Jakku Message: At the D'Qar's Resistance base, Major Taslin Brance informs General Leia Organa that Tuanul was wiped out and there was no sign of the map. Brance also told her that Poe Dameron and his droid were missing. Organa orders them to find BB-8 instead of contacting the New Republic.

2) Leia and the Resistance: Leia tells her emissary Korr Sella to warn the New Republic to take action against the First Order.

An important point to remember is that only Leia’s lines in these scenes would be fixed and they don’t have use them all, nor do they need to be used in order. One reason I expect they decided to use TFA footage over TLJ is that Leia wore the same outfit and was in mostly the same location/lighting for a large number of her scenes. This would make it a LOT easier to cobble something together that could function as a viable scene or two.

I do expect Leia to die during IX and due to lack of alternate footage I expect it to probably be a Holdo-like sacrifice where we don’t need to see the death itself to know she’s gone. I also expect a final Force Ghost composited in alongside Luke as well simply because that wouldn’t require any dialogue and so could be pulled from almost anywhere (my preference for a final Leia shot would to get video from that gorgeous photoshoot for TLJ where they had Mark and Carrie together... but that’s just me).

Been watching TV all day, seen the news just a few hours ago. I'm so happy Carrie is going to be in this somehow! Very surprised about Richard Grant being cast but I can easily see him playing a senior, older FO officer. Glad KMT is returning. Adam is second on the list after Daisy as well. In the new photos from filming his zombie film today he's looking slightly more muscular.

What JJ said here: "Finding a truly satisfying conclusion to the Skywalker saga without her eluded us." Tells me that while it's important for Leia to be given an appropriate sendoff, it has to be about the relationship with her son too. I really have to commend JJ on this. It would have been the much easier and far more convenient route to write her out in between films and have her death in the opening crawl but they went for the more harder and daunting option. Really curious to see how he pulls this off. Of course it could just be a flashback/hologram only.

Also, this should really just put the FOOSLS leak to bed. No recasting or CG Leia, and it's being billed as the final installment. No splitting the movie into two parts or extending the trilogy.

Kylo Rey wrote:
Also, this should really just put the FOOSLS leak to bed. No recasting or CG Leia, and it's being billed as the final installment. No splitting the movie into two parts or extending the trilogy.

@Kylo Rey

That was exactly what I was thinking- no Leia recast and no splitting the movie...I was already sure that leak was FAF anyways but the "splitting the movie" part was something that made me doubt it the most.

Sleemo posted this image (a part of a larger post - link below)

This indicates there is more than the deleted scenes that we know of in TFA with Carrie.  Correct? (If I recall, correctly) !!! (Squee!) Per this image, there is a possibility of a scene with Leia and Maz in Episode 9.  Or, replacing Maz with another character, as there is a comforting scene.  ??? (And possibly so much more  )



Larger Post Link: https://sleemo.tumblr.com/post/176353205702/carrie-fisher-on-the-set-of-star-wars-the-force

According to several stories, JJ cut more than 22 minutes of actual completed footage (i.e. with special effects complete) out of TFA in order to get it to what he felt would be a reasonable length. That doesn’t include any scenes filmed that never even had basic effects work done. Any of that footage could be used to cobble together Leia’s appearances from.

That shot with Leia interacting with Maz also highlights my previous point; that I think the reason they’re using TFA instead of TLJ is because almost all of Carrie’s scenes were shot with her in the same outfit and in similar lighting from one scene to the next, making it a lot easier to cobble bits from entirely different scenes from all different parts of TFA together into Leia’s scenes for IX. By contrast she wore several different outfits in different lighting during TLJ which would greatly limit the amount of cobbling together they could do with that footage.