The Last Jedi: Our Reviews and Reactions

ReyofLightSide wrote:I saw the move twice yesterday. I like the idea that we leave the theater feeling like Kylo. Everyone turned away from him. Everyone. His own mother. His mother! And then the love of his life.

Guys, we didn't get Kyo-the-mustache-twirling-villian in that final scene of him. We got someone broken and human. He got what he wanted and it wasn't what he wanted at all. He thought killing Han was the answer- nope. He thought doubling down on Renderer would be- he quickly saw that- nope, not that either.

Yeah they pulled the rug out from us but I don't know what else Rey could have done. Kylo became unhinged. She hesitates in that last scene but then gets resolve and shuts the door. Reylo is not dead by any means. They show us that by showing Snoke did not manipulate the Force bond. They are destiny. It is just going to be dark and messy getting there. Kylo is not going to get rewarded for bad behavior from Rey.

And I agree with something from tumblr- what did Rey see in the future vision of Ben that made her fly across the galaxy to him? It must have been powerful AF.

@ReyofLightSide

He's not unhinged. He's ill. Rey at the moment doesn't realise that. He needs her help more than anything. I really hope she realises that.

motherofpearl1 wrote:

ReyofLightSide wrote:I saw the move twice yesterday. I like the idea that we leave the theater feeling like Kylo. Everyone turned away from him. Everyone. His own mother. His mother! And then the love of his life.

Guys, we didn't get Kyo-the-mustache-twirling-villian in that final scene  of him.  We got someone broken and human. He got what he wanted and it wasn't what he wanted at all. He thought killing Han was the answer- nope. He thought doubling down on Renderer would be- he quickly saw that- nope, not that either.

Yeah they pulled the rug out from us but I don't know what else Rey could have done. Kylo became unhinged. She hesitates in that last scene but then gets resolve and shuts the door. Reylo is not dead by any means. They show us that by showing Snoke did not manipulate the Force bond. They are destiny. It is just going to be dark and messy getting there. Kylo is not going to get rewarded for bad behavior from Rey.

And I agree with something from tumblr- what did Rey see in the future vision of Ben that made her fly across the galaxy to him? It must have been powerful AF.

@ReyofLightSide

He's not unhinged. He's ill. Rey at the moment doesn't realise that. He needs her help more than anything. I really hope she realises that.

@motherofpearl1

This is true! He is in a full on mental breakdown and snapped. It doesn't excuse him or his actions for it- but we see why it is.

MeadowofAshes wrote:I seriously wonder if the entire purpose was to make the audience hate everyone except Ben -- really put us in his shoes and let us experience his emotions that came from being abused and then made to feel like a monster by the people who were supposed to be protecting him: coldness, an unsettling disturbance, deep sadness and disappointment, and sheer rage. Because that's sure as hell all I felt by the time Renperor happened.

If that was the goal -- Mission Accomplished.

Re ReyPoe: I hope she does go to bed with him. I hope she realizes he's as self-centered, narcissistic an a** there as he is in the cockpit. And then I hope she thinks about HandSex with Ben and knows deep down in her gut he'd have been the sensuous, tender lover she really wanted because he actually has freaking feelings for her.

@MeadowofAshes

Can I join your league? I'm with you in this.

I was thinking about the movie, and I remember one scene that disturbed me in the moment. When the fight with PG ended, Kylo looked at Snoke, as he was just assimilating what he had done, "I killed my master". It was just such a little but emotional scene, and Rey just looked at him as it wasn't important. I'm starting to think that, right now, he has more feelings for her than the other way around.

AnneNeville wrote:I trust Kylo's version more than Luke's. Once you ignite a lightsaber over someone, there's no taking it back. A moment of weakness is a thought. Drawing a weapon is action.

If you wake in the night to someone holding a pillow just above your face, you can't excuse it.

@AnneNeville

Yep. But I think Luke knew it. I have a feeling Luke will return as a FG and beg Rey not to turn her back on Kylo.

I saw the film last night and have such a jumble of thoughts!

My overwhelming take right now is that this story would make an excellent novel. The film flies by so fast that it is difficult to meditate on some of the really interesting ideas that are being explored about big themes like war, love, sacrifice. The plot is quite intricate and filled with fascinating twists of characters hitting dead ends and having to switch directions. The minor characters, like Holdo and DJ, are interesting commentaries on the human costs of endless war.  And Reylo is one of the most captivating romance stories ever - true equals that become more powerful together.

The experience of watching the film, however, was kind of taxing. There are so many offhand jokes that interrupt emotional moments that it was hard to settle in.  Perhaps this would change upon repeated viewings.

They are doing reverse Padme and Anikan and not being subtle about it. What if Vader had not choked Padme? What if he killed his master? What if he lived?

I don't why they went the route of Luke wanting to kill Ben and not the Vader reveal that made Ben snap?

Atenais wrote:

MeadowofAshes wrote:I seriously wonder if the entire purpose was to make the audience hate everyone except Ben -- really put us in his shoes and let us experience his emotions that came from being abused and then made to feel like a monster by the people who were supposed to be protecting him: coldness, an unsettling disturbance, deep sadness and disappointment, and sheer rage. Because that's sure as hell all I felt by the time Renperor happened.

If that was the goal -- Mission Accomplished.

Re ReyPoe: I hope she does go to bed with him. I hope she realizes he's as self-centered, narcissistic an a** there as he is in the cockpit. And then I hope she thinks about HandSex with Ben and knows deep down in her gut he'd have been the sensuous, tender lover she really wanted because he actually has freaking feelings for her.

@MeadowofAshes

Can I join your league? I'm with you in this.

I was thinking about the movie, and I remember one scene that disturbed me in the moment. When the fight with PG ended, Kylo looked at Snoke, as he was just assimilating what he had done, "I killed my master". It was just such a little but emotional scene, and Rey just looked at him as it wasn't important. I'm starting to think that, right now, he has more feelings for her than the other way around.

@Atenais

He does, I agree. He's clearly besotted with her. Nothing but looks of ardent love except when he's tacitly following Supreme S***head's orders. Meanwhile, he was the hot badboy beefcake she used to learn about the "ways of the Force" and while she may care about bringing him back to what she considers the right side of things, she doesn't truly care about Ben as he truly is and always will be - a broken man who will always have a darkness he has to control because of Kiddy Diddler Snoke.

ACHK!!! Do you remember Snoke being all creepster with the "Come closer my child..."

ReyofLightSide wrote:

motherofpearl1 wrote:

ReyofLightSide wrote:I saw the move twice yesterday. I like the idea that we leave the theater feeling like Kylo. Everyone turned away from him. Everyone. His own mother. His mother! And then the love of his life.

Guys, we didn't get Kyo-the-mustache-twirling-villian in that final scene  of him.  We got someone broken and human. He got what he wanted and it wasn't what he wanted at all. He thought killing Han was the answer- nope. He thought doubling down on Renderer would be- he quickly saw that- nope, not that either.

Yeah they pulled the rug out from us but I don't know what else Rey could have done. Kylo became unhinged. She hesitates in that last scene but then gets resolve and shuts the door. Reylo is not dead by any means. They show us that by showing Snoke did not manipulate the Force bond. They are destiny. It is just going to be dark and messy getting there. Kylo is not going to get rewarded for bad behavior from Rey.

And I agree with something from tumblr- what did Rey see in the future vision of Ben that made her fly across the galaxy to him? It must have been powerful AF.

@ReyofLightSide

He's not unhinged. He's ill. Rey at the moment doesn't realise that. He needs her help more than anything. I really hope she realises that.

@motherofpearl1

This is true! He is in a full on mental breakdown and snapped. It doesn't excuse him or his actions for it- but we see why it is.

@ReyofLightSide

ReyofLightSide wrote:

motherofpearl1 wrote:

ReyofLightSide wrote:I saw the move twice yesterday. I like the idea that we leave the theater feeling like Kylo. Everyone turned away from him. Everyone. His own mother. His mother! And then the love of his life.

Guys, we didn't get Kyo-the-mustache-twirling-villian in that final scene  of him.  We got someone broken and human. He got what he wanted and it wasn't what he wanted at all. He thought killing Han was the answer- nope. He thought doubling down on Renderer would be- he quickly saw that- nope, not that either.

Yeah they pulled the rug out from us but I don't know what else Rey could have done. Kylo became unhinged. She hesitates in that last scene but then gets resolve and shuts the door. Reylo is not dead by any means. They show us that by showing Snoke did not manipulate the Force bond. They are destiny. It is just going to be dark and messy getting there. Kylo is not going to get rewarded for bad behavior from Rey.

And I agree with something from tumblr- what did Rey see in the future vision of Ben that made her fly across the galaxy to him? It must have been powerful AF.

@ReyofLightSide

He's not unhinged. He's ill. Rey at the moment doesn't realise that. He needs her help more than anything. I really hope she realises that.

@motherofpearl1

This is true! He is in a full on mental breakdown and snapped. It doesn't excuse him or his actions for it- but we see why it is.

@ReyofLightSide

Poe did exactly the same at the beginning....and he doesn't have the excuse of being mentally ill.

ReyofLightSide wrote:I saw the move twice yesterday. I like the idea that we leave the theater feeling like Kylo. Everyone turned away from him. Everyone. His own mother. His mother! And then the love of his life.

Guys, we didn't get Kyo-the-mustache-twirling-villian in that final scene of him. We got someone broken and human. He got what he wanted and it wasn't what he wanted at all. He thought killing Han was the answer- nope. He thought doubling down on Renderer would be- he quickly saw that- nope, not that either.

Yeah they pulled the rug out from us but I don't know what else Rey could have done. Kylo became unhinged. She hesitates in that last scene but then gets resolve and shuts the door. Reylo is not dead by any means. They show us that by showing Snoke did not manipulate the Force bond. They are destiny. It is just going to be dark and messy getting there. Kylo is not going to get rewarded for bad behavior from Rey.

And I agree with something from tumblr- what did Rey see in the future vision of Ben that made her fly across the galaxy to him? It must have been powerful AF.

@ReyofLightSide

Go and tell that to Disney. So they don't fu*k it up.

motherofpearl1 wrote:

AnneNeville wrote:I trust Kylo's version more than Luke's. Once you ignite a lightsaber over someone, there's no taking it back. A moment of weakness is a thought. Drawing a weapon is action.

If you wake in the night to someone holding a pillow just above your face, you can't excuse it.

@AnneNeville

Yep. But I think Luke knew it. I have a feeling Luke will return as a FG and beg Rey not to turn her back on Kylo.

@motherofpearl1

At this point, with our uncle of the year. He might advise to get close to Kylo and actually do the deed, putting him out of his misery. Oh wait, Rian is not writing it, JJ is. Well, he liked it too anyway.

I wrote my predictions/Ep 9 fanfic in the Predictions thread. Maybe if you guys are interested we could discuss stuff there too after you're all done venting. Because I understand we need to vent. But yeah, let's hear out predictions too. iT's hopefull somewhat.

So I agree Leia giving up on her son is out of character and it really bothers me, but Han did the same thing but still tried to save him in tfa, so Leia isn't completely horrible and irredeemable because of this. Just cause she said it once doesn't actually mean she's given up for good cause she could've come back in the next movie, trying to save him like tfa Han. Idk my headcanon is that she made sure to leave the dice behind for him to find, but I guess I'm trying to feel better. Maybe that was what Luke even meant...like, Han isn't gone, but also, you can use this to try to plant more seeds for bringing your son back, who isn't gone either. Lol this is getting too involved I'm totally trying to feel better.

Also I don't understand why people blame Rey for not going with Kylo and say she created Supreme Leader Kylo...he was gonna make lots of people die and try to control the galaxy through force...he was already sumpreme leader Kylo before she rejected him...and that's still not good and she shouldn't have to agree to it and I don't blame her trying to take the lightsaber cause she had no weapon and he is powerful and could have tried to restrain her or imprison her. There wasn't really time to have a good long talk about it. It's not that I don't sympathize with him and how alone he ended up but Rey wasn't being completely horrible to him....at least I don't see it that way?

The Poe and Rey bad romance headcanons in this thread are totally surprising me?? I know Poe wasn't portrayed in a very good light in this film but he seems to be the punching bag for post-movie anger right now and I'm kinda shocked?? I thought people hated when the "good girl" has to learn how horrible and stupid it is to date the "bad boy" so I really don't understand why people would want her to learn a lesson like that from dating Poe?? I don't understand how that any different or any less of a moral warning story for little girls?? Maybe I'm just totally misunderstanding how everyone is feeling.

cherrylipstick wrote:Leia Poppins LOL! It was actually embarrassing

MeadowofAshes wrote:

What really pisses me off his how NO ONE in this God forsaken family understood that Snoke was torturing their boy. Instead, Leia sends the problem child away to train and Luke tries to kill his terrified, abused nephew in his sleep. Well done, Skywalkers.

@MeadowofAshes

Exactly!!!  
The more I think about the movie the more I'm pissed off that they decided to spend a lot of screentime showing Poe, the resistance and Finn/Rose doing basically pointless things, instead of spending precious time on the characters we already knew and cared about.
Even five/ten more minutes would have made a big difference and would have provided a greater empathy. Everything was really fast and cold, I didn't even cry once and I'm a huge cryer!  
I thought to see big painful angry emotional conflicts between the characters, past revelations, family drama and a greater attempt to humanize Kylo.
They did partly, but they had so much material about him to use, to make him more relatable (abusive Snoke, the mess of a family he had, his uncle!)
I definitely expected too much, what can I say, I'm a hopeless Kylo fangirl

@cherrylipstick

I was talking with my friend, who is just a huge SW fanboy, and he was telling me his impressions of the movie. I was so happy when he said, "After all that [the whole Kylo arc in the movie: being humiliated by Snoke, almost killed by Luke, killing Snoke, etc.], he has my full respect. He not only redeemed himself from episode VII (like all fanboys, he was mad at Kylo for killing Han Solo, his hero), but he became legend."

Atenais wrote:

cherrylipstick wrote:Leia Poppins LOL! It was actually embarrassing

MeadowofAshes wrote:

What really pisses me off his how NO ONE in this God forsaken family understood that Snoke was torturing their boy. Instead, Leia sends the problem child away to train and Luke tries to kill his terrified, abused nephew in his sleep. Well done, Skywalkers.

@MeadowofAshes

Exactly!!!  
The more I think about the movie the more I'm pissed off that they decided to spend a lot of screentime showing Poe, the resistance and Finn/Rose doing basically pointless things, instead of spending precious time on the characters we already knew and cared about.
Even five/ten more minutes would have made a big difference and would have provided a greater empathy. Everything was really fast and cold, I didn't even cry once and I'm a huge cryer!  
I thought to see big painful angry emotional conflicts between the characters, past revelations, family drama and a greater attempt to humanize Kylo.
They did partly, but they had so much material about him to use, to make him more relatable (abusive Snoke, the mess of a family he had, his uncle!)
I definitely expected too much, what can I say, I'm a hopeless Kylo fangirl

@cherrylipstick

I was talking with my friend, who is just a huge SW fanboy, and he was telling me his impressions of the movie. I was so happy when he said, "After all that [the whole Kylo arc in the movie: being humiliated by Snoke, almost killed by Luke, killing Snoke, etc.], he has my full respect. He not only redeemed himself from episode VII (like all fanboys, he was mad at Kylo for killing Han Solo, his hero), but he became legend."

@Atenais

Can you say your friend, he is 100% spot on. My thoughts.

Writing was such an epic fail. It was meandering, creating too many unnecessary steps. Just some examples:

Why have Fake Luke confront Kylo when his present mother could have done it? It would be a character moment for her to stall FO while Reduced Resistance escaped. Not to mention it would be emotional gut punch.

Why have Holdo at all when the conflict was Poe and Leia? Have him sacrifice himself since the character just doesn't work. That way he would have some meaning.

Why have a subplot about looking for one slicer and finding another when Rose could have been a slicer? Cut Canto Bight and just go straight to the Supremacy thanks to Finn's inside knowledge.

That way, you save running time, have a tighter plot, characters actually have a meaning.

So I saw it yesterday. I liked it, did not love it. But having been thinking and speculating and hoping, about what will be/will happen in this movie for 2 years, makes it a completely different viewing experience to any other movie I have ever watched, and I do not think I can judge it properly yet. Almost constantly I wanted to say “Wait, stop and rewind so I can see/hear this again (2-3 times), and then I need some time to think about it and process before we move on to the next bit ”.

I need to let it sink in for a bit and definitely rewatch it a few times. And my feelings for it may change (for the better or for the worse, who knows). But some first impressions and comments:

- I liked many things in the movie but overall it felt a bit disjointed and the tone was uneven. Not just the transition from scene to scene, but also the tone within a scene. Eg the humour: there were some jokes that I could objectively say they were funny, but the overall feeling and atmosphere was a bit off. Like Rey literally reaching out to touch a leaf, or telling Luke “Why not, you do not seem to be too busy here”. In many cases such things can lighten the mood, but here they just felt a little bit at odds with the serious, sombre tone of the storyline and interactions on Ahch-To. So I did not feel they worked exactly as intended (at least for me, and in the 1st viewing. I may reconsider in the future)

- As others have said, it felt a bit cold, in contrast to TFA where there was more warmth. For me TFA had its problems, but now I come to appreciate it more as it flowed more naturally and easily and it was more engaging (and I see one cannot take it for granted, and it is not easy to achieve, so hats off to JJ and I am now even happier that he is doing Ep9).

- I think it was good movie, but honestly can’t see why KK/LFL where in raves about it and gave RJ another trilogy based on this?! Why not give another trilogy to JJ, his movie was at least just as good overall, and it did make $ 2 billion. I get the feeling that KK/LFL really liked RJ as a person and loved working with him (and I can see why, he comes across from the interviews etc as a really lovely guy). So I get the feeling the decision was based on: “the movie is good and ticks the boxes we wanted (especially the being ‘different’ box), and RJ is so great work with, we want to work with him again”, rather than, “we think this movie is a masterpiece”.

- I liked Luke’s arc, and his heroic act at the end, and furthermore I had no problem with him considering killing Kylo. I liked Yoda. The rest of the supporting cast was ok (to me everyone else other than Rey, Kylo, Luke, were supporting/secondary characters)

-I see some people think Damerey could be a possibility? Personally I saw nothing of the sort.

-I definitely need to see it again to appreciate some of the details missed at 1st viewing. Like someone here mentioning that Luke looked younger with different hair (and also thinner I thought) because his projection is how Kylo would remember him from 6 years earlier. And in an online review it was pointed out how we initially see a resistance soldier walking on Crait and leaving red footprints. But when Luke appears, he leaves no footprints (clue to the fact he is not really there). These are all nice touches which I missed, and there must be many more of them.

-And to those that worry about the endgame regarding Reylo and whether Kylo lives, remember this is 3 act story: set up – conflict –resolution. And which just saw the conflict part : ) And Mr JJ prince-princess-castle Abrams will be resolving this. I feel there is nothing to worry about : )

1. I have no reason to be disappointed in Leia for giving up on her son. He killed the love of her life, his own father.
2. Reylo is alive, and powerful. His connection with her gives him the strength and resolve to kill Snoke. Snoke's influence is what enhanced Ben's darkness in the first place, and what scared Luke, led to him losing his cool and led to the destruction of his Jedi Academy.
3. Anything Kylo does after the lightsaber struggle and Rey leaving cannot be attributed to what's in Kylo's heart - he's in a fit of rage and hurt.

I'm coming to terms with the movie. I think it was too much story for one movie, and it suffers. But as hours go by, I think it's actually a pretty good story.

fuhry wrote:1. I have no reason to be disappointed in Leia for giving up on her son.  He killed the love of her life, his own father.  
2. Reylo is alive, and powerful.  His connection with her gives him the strength and resolve to kill Snoke.  Snoke's influence is what enhanced Ben's darkness in the first place, and what scared Luke, led to him losing his cool and led to the destruction of his Jedi Academy.  
3. Anything Kylo does after the lightsaber struggle and Rey leaving cannot be attributed to what's in Kylo's heart - he's in a fit of rage and hurt.  

I'm coming to terms with the movie.  I think it was too much story for one movie, and it suffers.  But as hours go by, I think it's actually a pretty good story.

@fuhry

Motherly love?

Even with what he did, she is the daughter of Darth Vader. Should have some compassion and actually trying to bring him back or talk to him. Now we got Matrix Luke. She has her part of being responsible and she abandons him without a second thought knowing Snoke manipulated with him since he was in her womb. I have a big fu*king problem with that.

vaderito wrote:Writing was such an epic fail. It was meandering, creating too many unnecessary steps. Just some examples:

Why have Fake Luke confront Kylo when his present mother could have done it? It would be a character moment for her to stall FO while Reduced Resistance escaped. Not to mention it would be emotional gut punch.

Why have Holdo at all when the conflict was Poe and Leia? Have him sacrifice himself since the character just doesn't work. That way he would have some meaning.

Why have a subplot about looking for one slicer and finding another when Rose could have been a slicer? Cut Canto Bight and just go straight to the Supremacy thanks to Finn's inside knowledge.

That way, you save running time, have a tighter plot, characters actually have a meaning.

@vaderito

The rising action was truly awful and I'm not even sure what the climax was.

I  saw it last night forewarned a little of how to respond and that helped. I do agree with the disappointment over the potential lost opportunities for things like the origins/history of the Force and the backstory about Ben's fall/Snoke's agenda. Though I suspect that's all being held back for novels and comic books.

Positives - definitely that he made Rey and Ben's connection/relationship his priority. Like maybe that's the story he wanted to tell and had to go through all the other plot filler with the Resistance and Canto Bight to tell it.

1. Force Bond was straight out of the subplot JJ had in Fringe where Olivia lucid dreams into the past for an investigation and connects
with her former lover/partner during a time before things went wrong between them. And somebody had posted to the board RJ's old Vimeo
account where he had done a short film about a young woman who starts entering a young man's dreams by accident and they become lovers.

2. Oh those poor kids, they just keep breaking each other's hearts. Rey  is the Jane Eyre/Cathy Earnshaw to Ben's Edward Fairfax Rochester/Heathcliffe.  And god lord, is he ever Heathcliffe in Space. Just tell her that you love her, you idiot, and run away together. And don't rub her face in being from the  wrong side of the tracks - you know she's way too good for you. He's still got  a lot of growing up to do for them to be together. As long as Hux doesn't stage a coup against him. He genuinely loves Rey, but his problem is that he's still a selfish a**hole. Shoulda just been happy to break free from Snoke and get the f*ck out of there with her. He got greedy instead and that's what hurt her.

Dude accomplished everything grandpa failed at in the PT - overthrew his cruel master, saved the woman he loved who had been marked for
death by said master, grabbed the reins of power and yet he's got nothing. Also that bit from Snoke about having the heart of his father
- ouch for that being where the saber went. Sounds like Han was not down with sending Ben away but acquiesced to Luke and Leia. Meaning
Ben ended up killing the one person who was on his side. All he has left now is Rey, but he is so in the doghouse with her after what he did. Anybody else notice that he lies to Hux and claims that she killed Snoke? Nice move there, blaming your girlfriend for what you did.

3. Finn and Rose were definitely the kid's subplot, down to the shamelessly adorable orphan laborers. I just wish that they had spun off her that story for a children's movie. But Rose really the 3rd protagonist of the movie, along with Rey and Ben. And she comes out the best/most progressed at the end.

4. Laura Dern and BdT were 100% pointless, there to fill nothing roles with their charisma and because they have kids. RIP Phasma, another
glorified cameo.

5. Rian Johnson sure went to town with killing the past and fan theories. RIP Rey Reylated to anybody, poor tiny little Rey got sold off by her parents to Unkar Plutt literally for beer money. All we need to know what happened with Ben is that Luke contemplated killing him in his sleep, it had nothing to do with the Vader reveal.

6. Speaking of which, was there anything in there which was the supposed detail in Bloodline they said would be shown?

I do agree it doesn't have the warmth you'd get from Kasdan's writing. Mark Hammil surprised me and I wouldn't be surprised if he was
channeling some Lee Marvin (they did a film together around the OT time period) in his performance. Also yep The Searchers reference was
deliberate - Luke felt Ben was tainted by the Darkside the way Ethan thinks Debbie is tainted by her time with the Comanche and both uncles
have the intention of murder. And Rey intervenes, same as the Jeffrey Hunter character.

There's going to be a lot of this where more ground gets covered in the tie-in novels (more $$$ for Disney). Part of me feels like the deeper storylines we'd hoped for got scrapped because that's not something Disney can make toy or publishing money off of.

One thing, If Disney want to promote Poe as Rey’s love interest by the next movie by giving him too much of screen time then they’re doing it wrong. Because technically Poe in this movie is just being a nuisance and such a waste of screen time. He can be erased from the movie and it doesn’t change the outcome. I feel Poe in this movie is like being a walking vase.

If they think they can sell more of Poe’s dolls after this movie they’re wrong. I can see Finn/Rose getting more popularity as even though they’re not very useful they still actually did something in this movie. But Poe? Nope. Sorry.

Please don’t kill Kylo Ren off if he is selling so well along with Rey, I beg you Disney.

Atenais wrote:

I was talking with my friend, who is just a huge SW fanboy, and he was telling me his impressions of the movie. I was so happy when he said, "After all that [the whole Kylo arc in the movie: being humiliated by Snoke, almost killed by Luke, killing Snoke, etc.], he has my full respect. He not only redeemed himself from episode VII (like all fanboys, he was mad at Kylo for killing Han Solo, his hero), but he became legend."

@Atenais

Oh I'm happy to read it!    

vaderito wrote:Writing was such an epic fail. It was meandering, creating too many unnecessary steps. Just some examples:

Why have Fake Luke confront Kylo when his present mother could have done it? It would be a character moment for her to stall FO while Reduced Resistance escaped. Not to mention it would be emotional gut punch.

Why have Holdo at all when the conflict was Poe and Leia? Have him sacrifice himself since the character just doesn't work. That way he would have some meaning.

Why have a subplot about looking for one slicer and finding another when Rose could have been a slicer? Cut Canto Bight and just go straight to the Supremacy thanks to Finn's inside knowledge.

That way, you save running time, have a tighter plot, characters actually have a meaning.

@vaderito

We heard rumors that they cut Leia's part down due to Carrie's health. That is probably the explanation.

I watched the movie again today and I liked it a little better. I think it's easier on a second viewing because I didn't go watch it full of expectations on how the scenes would play out. I still find the Resistance plot weak compared to Reylo and the force plot, but it's hard to go against something so mesmerizing.

The movie still falls apart for me after the Throne Room fight, though. It's just incredibly hurtful for me to see Kylo, a character I care so much about, basically just self-destruct like that. I also continue having issues with Rey basically disappearing during the 3rd act and Leia saying her son is completely gone. That just doesn't sound like her at all.

I was also thinking about what Rian had said earlier, that when he started writing TLJ he had thought about what was the hardest thing these characters could face. In Kylo's case going against Snoke is one thing, yes, but I think the hardest is at the very end, where he basically is fulfilling Vader's legacy by killing his past and attachments, but finds himself utterly alone and broken in the process. I hope the ending means he's starting to live with the consequences of what he's doing and that will put him in the true path to redemption. If they kill him at the end I'm just so done :/. I also still can't understand his motivation to want to burn the world down.

Anyway, I just find this movie too bleak and dark and I'm one that loves a good tragedy. I understand it's a dark middle chapter, but I just left the theater with a knot in my throat and well, it's Star Wars, I shouldn't leave feeling so hopeless.

So I watched the film last night and I thought it was really phenomenal. A great film and a great Star Wars film. Funny, sweet, heartwarming, angsty as all hell. It was a little fast paced, especially in the beginning, but other than that minor drawback I found the whole experience incredibly enjoyable. Heartbreaking, yes, but enjoyable. And that's to be expected of the darker middle chapter.

I don't really share the criticism about wasted new characters. I felt all were used well to facilitate the arcs of the more core leads. Holdo came as a surprise to me. I really liked her and felt she served an essential purpose in the story. I guess DJ was a little weird, but I didn't find him unnecessary.

Rose and Finn's story was great. Sure it wasn't quite as magnetic as Kylo and Rey, but I still enjoyed it immensely. Rose is just wonderful, and she plays really well off Finn. They are the sweetest thing together. I also really loved Rose's musical theme.

Renperor was probably the single greatest comedy act I've ever witnessed. Good gosh. I was actually laughing in the theatre. Actually a lot of people were. This kid is never going to be Supreme Leader Anything. He's a pathetic, conflicted, ignorant mess who got deservedly and unceremoniously jilted by his entire family and now the love of his life. It's impossible to even be mad at him because he's just such a pitiful fool. AMAZING character who we now get to watch drag himself out of the ditch, but a complete moron nonetheless.

Rey and Kylo... oh Rey and Kylo. They are more hypnotizing and magnetic than ever.Some scenes I particularly enjoyed. Handsex. One of the most beautiful pieces of imagery every to film in my opinion. I don't really understand why people are attributing the visions Kylo and Rey had of each other to Snoke. In that briefest touch, they saw potential, but conflicting futures. I've seen some people here say that Rey decided to save Ben Solo too quickly, and I'm going to have to disagree. Here's why. When she touched his hand, she fell in love with what she saw. She fell in love with her belonging, with Ben Solo. And here's the thing for me. We, the audience, never meet Ben Solo. Kylo Ren is still purely Kylo Ren, a villain, and I think that's not something we really prepared ourselves for. He really thinks Ben Solo is gone. Rey thinks otherwise. Well we know Kylo interpreted what he saw when he and Rey touched very wrongly. They will stand together one day, just not in the way he thinks. Against all odds, what Rey saw is closer to the truth. She just expected too much too soon. She had unfeasible expectations of him in his present state. Kylo is very much a Dark sider with a little Light. He's not ready to realize he's wrong or even that Ben Solo is still alive. I think it was a bold choice to have Rey fall in love with what she saw in her vision while not letting the audience see it with her.

Rey slamming the door in Kylo's face while he kneels in a pathetic heap on the ground. Another gorgeous scene, and one that really solidified Luke's plan to me. Luke knows what's up in my opinion. He knows he can't save Ben Solo. Only Rey and Ben himself can do that. The dice! Oh the dice. In my opinion, Luke knows how this is going to go down. He gave those dice to Leia who then dropped them on the floor and were then found by pathetic Kylo. Rey hasn't given up on him forever. She knows what she saw in her vision is the truth. She's just given up on his moronic *** for the time being.

The film definitely doesn't fill me with the same joy as The Force Awakens, and I'm sure I won't go see it 8 times like I did with that movie. I'm one of those people who can't really watch ESB without watching ROTJ right afterward. I can watch ANH all on its own just like I can watch TFA all on its own, but ESB, and I suspect TLJ in the future, will always have to come with their resolving chapters. Kylo is the only Skywalker and I just don't see LF being okay with doing away with the family name forever. The stakes are so incredibly high for episode IX and I love it that way. I'm sure I won't bother speculating about IX to the extent I did VIII. Reylos won the TFA speculation contest. We know where it's going. The direction of the story isn't really that open anymore, especially for Rey and Kylo. J.J. just needs to conclude a redemption story, not only for Kylo but for all of the Skywalkers, and resolve Rey and Ben's relationship in a way that ties all three sagas together. Full on reverse Anidala is they way they're going IMO. I'm calling the Rey and Kylo wedding at the end of the saga, righting all the wrongs of the previous 8 films. J.J.'s our fairy tale wizard, and I think he's going to give us the happy ending we deserve.