ARCHIVE: Rey's Lineage Discussion II - 2

Gemini wrote:that Saber look a lot like those small hole parts on Reys staff, moreso that Mauls

I've seen other images of Mauls saber which have those holes as well

Is it a dark side type of saber?

Force22 wrote:Well, first of all, I think this thread belongs in the speculation for the next episode, since it wasn't revealed in TFA.

Anyways, we were discussing parentage the other way (not in the nicest way, unfortunately), and I realized there's a factor that cannot be forgotten when discussing parentage: Rey (honorary) Solo!

The orphan has already found a "father" and a "mother" in Han and Leia(according to script, even), she has already found a place of belonging. Her relationship with Luke doesn't seem to be daughter like, because she's he's apprentice, at least that's what the pic with Luke on Rey's back suggests (I know it's a joke, but still...). All the spoilers suggest a master/apprentice relationship, and it's right, because, at this point, to find another father would just erase Han's memory.

So... if Rey has already found the nice lovely family and  two people to call mom and dad (one of them already dead), what's next for her in the story? To find belonging? Again? That doesn't make any sense. What needs to be revealed is her backstory, her identity, etc.

She could be for instance a special girl Kylo and Luke had heard about, or a girl who had been in a special Jedi temple, or even some sort of chosen one, lots of possibilities, so her identity is important.

Now, she won't find a family to run back to, because she has already found another one, and cause Maz told her they aren't coming back. So... it can't be a nice family. They could all be already dead, or they could be people she can't find belonging with. So... I don't think her identity is about whose blood she carries, but more related to what secret her identity reveals. But it has to be a secret with impact on the plot, just being someone's descendent for the heck of it doesn't cut it. So, yes, she could be Kenobi, Palpatine, Vos, etc, but her blood lineage is not important in itself. Her identity is important, as who she is, or what she means. If they manage to do that and give her some known character for background, all right, but I don't think just being someone's descendent answers the question about her mystery and about what happened to her, it's more related to who she is, and what secrets she carries.

Not sure if I'm making sense. I just wanted people to be happy and start speculating about her parentage again. I think her origins are a big mystery of the ST, and I, for one, love mysteries and love solving puzzles.

FrolickingFizzgig wrote:

At last actual confirmation that Rey began her existence with Lucas. This Tweet obviously doesn't tell us how much Rey changed from the Lucas treatment to the JJ treatment, but it is the first time this information has ever been spelled out. Every other time Pablo has mentioned it more along the lines of "It was George's idea to have a female protagonist" (a female protagonist, not specifically Rey). I don't necessarily think this means her background was always the same or the character underwent no changes between treatments, but it's definitely some of the more compelling evidence for Rey Legacy I've seen.

It is possible that there was a general agreement "Rey is related to (Character X)", but it was left up to future storytellers to explain exactly how Rey ties to Lucas' chosen bloodline. Kenobi is definitely one of the most realistic options, and we all know George would have had no problem with retcon.

There is also the possibility Rey was never a "legacy" character of any kind, even in the Lucas treatment, and George's treatment surrounded an unrelated character interacting with the Skywalker grandchildren.

WhatGirl wrote:Something has just occurred to me.

Rey slept inside of a downed AT-AT. She had a doll of a Rebel pilot.

What if her parents are in fact from opposing factions who ran away together and ended up hiding on Jakku?

This would not make the parents' identities important, per se. Their names could very well be virtually unknown. But it would explain the need for mystery surrounding Rey's parentage if she is the product of a forbidden romance.

It could also be done in a very simple and brief way. There wouldn't be the need for an elaborate story that goes into details. It could be summed up in minutes, and it wouldn't be a huge deal apart from explaining why her parents had felt the need to hide, and how she ended up alone.

Not to mention, it could be foreshadowing for a future romance between two people who, by all rights, should hate each other.

WhatGirl wrote:Something has just occurred to me.

Rey slept inside of a downed AT-AT. She had a doll of a Rebel pilot.

What if her parents are in fact from opposing factions who ran away together and ended up hiding on Jakku?

This would not make the parents' identities important, per se. Their names could very well be virtually unknown. But it would explain the need for mystery surrounding Rey's parentage if she is the product of a forbidden romance.

It could also be done in a very simple and brief way. There wouldn't be the need for an elaborate story that goes into details. It could be summed up in minutes, and it wouldn't be a huge deal apart from explaining why her parents had felt the need to hide, and how she ended up alone.

Not to mention, it could be foreshadowing for a future romance between two people who, by all rights, should hate each other.

Edited to add further thoughts: What Rey's parents did in this case could essentially be considered on par with going into exile. For those who believe Kylo may go into exile with Rey willingly following him, it could stand as a possible parallel.

panki wrote:

WhatGirl wrote:Something has just occurred to me.

Rey slept inside of a downed AT-AT. She had a doll of a Rebel pilot.

What if her parents are in fact from opposing factions who ran away together and ended up hiding on Jakku?

This would not make the parents' identities important, per se. Their names could very well be virtually unknown. But it would explain the need for mystery surrounding Rey's parentage if she is the product of a forbidden romance.

It could also be done in a very simple and brief way. There wouldn't be the need for an elaborate story that goes into details. It could be summed up in minutes, and it wouldn't be a huge deal apart from explaining why her parents had felt the need to hide, and how she ended up alone.

Not to mention, it could be foreshadowing for a future romance between two people who, by all rights, should hate each other.

Edited to add further thoughts: What Rey's parents did in this case could essentially be considered on par with going into exile. For those who believe Kylo may go into exile with Rey willingly following him, it could stand as a possible parallel.

@WhatGirl

This sounds very similar to the situation in the EU book series- The Jedi Prince... the Jedi Prince is a young boy named Ken who grew up in an isolated environment in the remains of an old jedi city, speaks droid, is good with mechanical stuff, is a good pilot and a powerful FS (showing both light and dark side abilities)- like a certain FS girl we know.... he only has a first name and wonders who left him alone in that city when he was small... he thinks he is related to Obi-wan because Luke gets messages about this boy from Obi-wan through the Force.....interestingly, his real heritage is like what you suggested- he turns out to be the child from a forbidden romance..... his mother was a captured jedi and his father was Palpatine's son, who was imprisoned by the imperials who wanted to keep power for themselves....his mother tried to get him to safety so he could choose his own destiny and not be bound by his heritage, which is a lovely message........ I wonder if they will take this route with Rey....

Terry Windling wrote:But in all the orphan fantasies and myths, you always find out who the parents are. . .and lo and behold, they always turn out to be heroes and kings, not the maid pregnant by the stable boy or the poor couple down the lane who have simply had one child too many.



We find them everywhere in fantasy fiction: the "orphaned heroes," young men and women whose parents are dead, absent, or unknown, who turn out to be the heirs to the kingdom, the destined pullers of swords from stones, the keys to the riddles, the prophesies' answers, the bearers of powerful magic.

TV tropes wrote:Despite growing up with an otherwise mundane childhood with nary an inkling of the extraordinary, our hero jumps into the thick of things and becomes a hero, or is a Weirdness Magnet and thrust into adventures he can barely fathom. A ways through the series, they'll find out that they're actually heirs to a Secret Legacy of heroism. Maybe it's an old ally of their parents, the parents themselves (though a lot of the time, the legacy is from the father's side), or discovering a hidden cache of artifacts and weapons that belonged to his parents. In any case, characters who have a Secret Legacy are heirs to a family tradition of unusual and heroic proportions. Crime fighting, archaeological adventure, and super heroing are just some examples. Maybe it's "Genetic" or In the Blood, but more often than not it's adventure that finds them, or simple common nature with the parents that leads to the hero picking up his birthright.


Some orphans have it easy, but not these ones.

This trope is about fiction highlighting the unpleasant side of losing one's parents to death or abandonment. The parents have been lost recently, and the main plot (or at least a major subplot) involves dealing with this loss. This generally includes some combination of:

   Grieving over the loss.
   Finding surrogate parents or family, whether blood relatives or True Companions. Complications may arise from finding a new family (perhaps involving a stay at the Orphanage of Fear or under an Illegal Guardian), or from fitting in with the new family. Expect the kid to refer to the new parents by their first name, rather than Mom or Dad, for some time.
   Discovering some heretofore-unknown aspect of the parents' lives, and investigating it. This attempt to understand their roots can be a subtle (or not) metaphor for the search for self-understanding.



 

TV tropes wrote:Got a good Ancestral Weapon? Got a cherished family recipe for whoop-a**? There's only one thing to make this heroic picture complete: at least one sword-wielding, name-taking hero in your family tree. Maybe more. No wonder you've got a thing about saving people — it's In the Blood.

Maybe not as shiny as full-on Divine Parentage,note  but it certainly explains that Orphan's Plot Trinket.

Makes a great surprise if there's a Luke, I Am Your Father moment in store.

In short, a character is a descendant of a famous hero, regardless of if he knows it or not, or how strong the blood is. Compare Tell Me About My Father, where the character loves to think about his dead/absentee parents as heroes, regardless of the truth. Compare Single Line of Descent where apparently there's only one person per generation who carries the gene.

Almost guaranteed to inherit an Ancestral Weapon at some point.

Subtrope of Famous Ancestor. Generally found or at least claimed among those with Blue Blood, although they may not initially know about it.

WhatGirl wrote:

panki wrote:

WhatGirl wrote:Something has just occurred to me.

Rey slept inside of a downed AT-AT. She had a doll of a Rebel pilot.

What if her parents are in fact from opposing factions who ran away together and ended up hiding on Jakku?

This would not make the parents' identities important, per se. Their names could very well be virtually unknown. But it would explain the need for mystery surrounding Rey's parentage if she is the product of a forbidden romance.

It could also be done in a very simple and brief way. There wouldn't be the need for an elaborate story that goes into details. It could be summed up in minutes, and it wouldn't be a huge deal apart from explaining why her parents had felt the need to hide, and how she ended up alone.

Not to mention, it could be foreshadowing for a future romance between two people who, by all rights, should hate each other.

Edited to add further thoughts: What Rey's parents did in this case could essentially be considered on par with going into exile. For those who believe Kylo may go into exile with Rey willingly following him, it could stand as a possible parallel.

@WhatGirl

This sounds very similar to the situation in the EU book series- The Jedi Prince... the Jedi Prince is a young boy named Ken who grew up in an isolated environment in the remains of an old jedi city, speaks droid, is good with mechanical stuff, is a good pilot and a powerful FS (showing both light and dark side abilities)- like a certain FS girl we know.... he only has a first name and wonders who left him alone in that city when he was small... he thinks he is related to Obi-wan because Luke gets messages about this boy from Obi-wan through the Force.....interestingly, his real heritage is like what you suggested- he turns out to be the child from a forbidden romance..... his mother was a captured jedi and his father was Palpatine's son, who was imprisoned by the imperials who wanted to keep power for themselves....his mother tried to get him to safety so he could choose his own destiny and not be bound by his heritage, which is a lovely message........ I wonder if they will take this route with Rey....

@panki

I am not familiar with the EU at all, so thank you for sharing this with me!

It would be an amazing message for sure. Kylo, the last Skywalker, is the one who feels trapped by his heritage and destiny. Rey, with no known surname, does not seem to know which side she comes from and is able to find her own path. Giving her an important surname at this point would undermine that message, in my opinion.

Rey's parents might have chosen to isolate themselves from everything political, if indeed they came from opposing sides. They may have had no choice but to leave everything and everyone they ever knew behind in order to be together. Perhaps they were even on the run. Either way, Jakku seems to be the place for that - it is the very definition of a no man's land.

And all of this can tie in seamlessly with Kylo's redemption and with Reylo. Dark sider who believed his heritage was everything + light side Jedi without a known legacy made her own way in spite of the odds = forbidden romance of an epic scale.

reylo1992 wrote:

Darth Dingbat wrote:Accidentally stumbled upon this post... I don't necessarily agree with it, but I thought it was interesting nonetheless.

http://www.alexbclark.com/movies/rey-will-turn-to-the-dark-side-in-episode-viii/

@Darth Dingbat

Very interesting post! I don't necessarily agree with all of the content either but as the author pointed it out it is interesting to notice the movement of the camera in this final shot as if the intention was to anticipate the plot of the next episode.

I may be wrong but I think that this is a callback to what happened earlier between Kylo and Rey in the forest. While Rey stands on the right in the first shot, she stands on the left in the second shot.



While both situations are similar, the contrast regarding the behavior of the characters is stunning:

1. According to the novelization, both Kylo and Luke recognize who Rey is, precisely when she holds the lightsaber in front of them
2. While Kylo's face is relaxed, Luke's is tense.
3. While Rey seems amazed in front of Kylo, she seems unease in front of Luke
4. While she holds the lightsaber with her right hand in front of Kylo, she holds it in her left hand in front of Luke. I believe that this detail is no accident knowing that the left is traditionally associated with something pejorative

What's more, Luke is the only person who reacts to Rey with such relunctant expression  and who doesn't seem to fall under her spell like the others do. Rey makes puppy eyes as if she does feel rejected, which is more or less the same expression that she has when Kylo calls her a scavenger with disregard:



The point is to discover why do Luke and Kylo react to her like that? Luke's reaction is completely strange knowing that he is the last jedi remaining in this galaxy far away. He should be happy (at least relieved) to know that after all these years he can finally train a  young FS girl to become a Jedi in order to defeat the FO and bring the Jedi Order back. Kylo to the contrary should treat her like a threat given that his goal is to kill all the Jedi until the last one but instead of that he  accepts her immediately and completely. So something there is amiss...

Maybe the only reason is that Luke  already feels some darkness in her (Kylo's presence?) and is simply afraid to fail once again as he did with Kylo. However, if Rey is gonna to be truly tempted in Ep.VIII, I can't imagine that the only reason would be: she is simply attracted to the villain. There must be something more that would raise conflict in her and give her some more reason to fall in love with Kylo. The only personal reason that I see is her birth family's fate because her only real motivation/obsession in Ep.VII is to be reunited with them.

The dialogue with Maz Kanata makes me think that Rey's parents' destiny will have a profound impact on her even if her heroine's journey is not where she come's from (behind: find her birth family) but where she goes (ahead: find her future family) by finding out who is that someone that corresponds to the belonging she seeks (her future husband). Given Maz's facial expression and Rey's reaction to the "they're never coming back" line, it is hard to believe that her parents are still alive. Natural deaths are no common thing in Star Wars...

...and Rey seems a little too much fascinated by Luke from the beginning!


What if Rey would turn to the dark side because of Luke (symbolized by the camera movement from the right to the left in the ending scene) and she would return to the light because Kylo would be the one (instead of Luke) to come back for her - I'll come back sweetheat, I promise! - (symbolized by Rey's position on the right side of the screen while she was on the left side in the two previous scenes with Kylo)?



But this is pure speculation!

Daisy Ridley Q&A wrote:
Everyone wants to know who Rey's parents are. Do you know?

Yeah.

Will the viewer know after the first episode or not necessarily?

Questions will be answered, absolutely. The main question will be answered.

ISeeAnIsland wrote:Someone on another forum dug up an old interview with Daisy from BEFORE TFA was released, and I thought that it was worth sharing here:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/features/next-gen-2015-new-star-836913

This is the bit that's relevant to this thread:

Daisy Ridley Q&A wrote:
Everyone wants to know who Rey's parents are. Do you know?

Yeah.

Will the viewer know after the first episode or not necessarily?

Questions will be answered, absolutely. The main question will be answered.

IoJovi wrote:

ISeeAnIsland wrote:Someone on another forum dug up an old interview with Daisy from BEFORE TFA was released, and I thought that it was worth sharing here:

http://www.hollywoodreporter.com/features/next-gen-2015-new-star-836913

This is the bit that's relevant to this thread:

Daisy Ridley Q&A wrote:
Everyone wants to know who Rey's parents are. Do you know?

Yeah.

Will the viewer know after the first episode or not necessarily?

Questions will be answered, absolutely. The main question will be answered.

@ISeeAnIsland

The main question being is Rey Luke or Leia's. Yeah that was a pretty clear no...

At least to me...

IoJovi wrote:Yeah, I don't think any of the folks in charge knew how far sideways the Reywalker speculation was going to go.  It may have been an accidental slip, but I don't think JJ's half hearted retraction during Reygate was his idea.  It most likely was Disney or possibly some higher up at Lucasfilm that wanted to keep the buzz going.  

Everything we've found so far has been planted there purposely by the filmmakers with painstaking care.  Why would they want their film misinterpretated?  Sure, there's always the surprise twist, but as we know there are folks out there who have put their heart and soul into Reywalker that are very likely going to end up disappointed.  TPTB have to know that.

CienaRee wrote:

IoJovi wrote:Yeah, I don't think any of the folks in charge knew how far sideways the Reywalker speculation was going to go.  It may have been an accidental slip, but I don't think JJ's half hearted retraction during Reygate was his idea.  It most likely was Disney or possibly some higher up at Lucasfilm that wanted to keep the buzz going.  

Everything we've found so far has been planted there purposely by the filmmakers with painstaking care.  Why would they want their film misinterpretated?  Sure, there's always the surprise twist, but as we know there are folks out there who have put their heart and soul into Reywalker that are very likely going to end up disappointed.  TPTB have to know that.

@IoJovi

I'm imaginign right now tons of angry articales about fans being led to believe Rey's a Skywalker after episode 8 and honestly I don't blame them.It's awful to be led to believe that you theory is possibly the  most likely outcome and the  you realize that wasn't the case and TBTB just wanted your money,it makes you feel used.