ARCHIVE: Rey and Kylo - Beauty and the Beast, Scavenger and the Monstah, Their Bond, His Love, Her Confused Feelings - 7

Lol,I was going throug the anti-reyo tag just to compare with the Reylo on(there's no comarison the Reylo tag on tumblr is one hudnred percent better than the anti one and I'm not syaing this as shipper it's just so much better over all)and I stumbled on this blog called Rey against reylo(I kid you not that's the name of the blog)and I couldn't believe that this gufset comapring Reylo vs Finnrey with a quote about racism below has got over 5 thousand likes  
http://reyagainstreylo.tumblr.com/post/145580481417/phamsa-there-is-racism-in-the-writing-of
Like  the maker of this gift toally twisted it to make it look like Reylo is indeed some twisted relationship and the only reasons Reylof ans love it is because they're racist.
“There is racism in the writing of thousands of words’ worth of dissertation exploring the possibilities of Kylo Ren’s character based on the qualities and story arc that Finn has already shown and whose own plotline is canonically more feasible to what you lot claim as a powerful connection with Rey than the character who is the villain and has done nothing positive for/towards Rey. You lot have blatantly erased Finn’s characterization and actions. This is not isolated in that article. It’s a sentiment repeated continually by shippers that somehow pop-up in the FinnRey, Finn, and other tags. […] You lot are so concerned that you’re being accused of racism and instead of investigating yourselves of the inherent prejudices you might have, you decide to separate yourself from “the rest” which does nothing to quell the problem. Saying that majority of you are not racist does not magically negate r*ylo shippers from baring real-life prejudices that bleed into the consumption and interpretation of fiction. Your intent, no matter how positive you think it is, does not negate the impact of your and your lot’s actions, words, and works, that reek of internalized racism.

Reality vs narrative vs genre confusion. Finn is in the b plot, with the resistance, he's out of the Force plot. Their mouths will taste bitter after chapter VIII.

aw, sorry folks...but Finn has nothing to do with what's going on between Rey and Kylo...its Rey, Kylo and Luke on Ach-to. Finn's in the B-plot, and that's not because anyone's racist..its because his story is in the B-plot and that's the way it is.

Mana wrote:aw, sorry folks...but Finn has nothing to do with what's going on between Rey and Kylo...its Rey, Kylo and Luke on Ach-to. Finn's in the B-plot, and that's not because anyone's racist..its because his story is in the B-plot and that's the way it is.

@Mana

Right?What they're saying make snos ense-so because we're analyzing Kylo's character and believe he coudl redeem himself that makes us racists because we want him to be who Finn is and take Finn's place?WTH???

CienaRee wrote:

Mana wrote:aw, sorry folks...but Finn has nothing to do with what's going on between Rey and Kylo...its Rey, Kylo and Luke on Ach-to. Finn's in the B-plot, and that's not because anyone's racist..its because his story is in the B-plot and that's the way it is.

@Mana

Right?What they're saying make snos ense-so because we're analyzing Kylo's character and believe he coudl redeem himself that makes us racists because we want him to be who Finn is and take Finn's place?WTH???

@CienaRee

that's just their own insecurities creeping in...I'm hoping Finn will get a satisfying character arc...but he's just not a character written for epic development like Kylo or Rey, sorry but it is what it is, take it up with the writers if you don't like it.

Krafty wrote:

ladyconsular wrote:

Krafty wrote:

BenRey wrote:

Krafty wrote:I never thought Kylo was abusive. Brazen and reckless maybe, but never abusive.
When I say that, I'm discounting all the bad things he's done...I'm just saying his dynamics with Rey were never abusive.
Dealing with real life antis is exhausting. I made the slip up of saying I was a Reylo-er the other day when asked who I ship and the shaming was kind of absurd.  

Side Note: I was lurking on Instagram in the Reylo tag (because, why not?) and I noticed people bugging out because Daisey and Carrie were liking Reylo pictures. Huh, that's kind of interesting, yes?

I'm curious

What did they say exactly? How old were they? Gender?

@BenRey

Two boys, one girl. They are older than me, I think they're 22-24 or something. They are kind of geeky Star Wars fans, pretty knowledgeable I would say.
They were discussing the pairings of "who's ending up with who" and what not, Finn and Rey being very popular, and Poe and Rey very close second. (clearly they're not up to date on their spoilers lol) I was nonchalantly asked what I thought, and without thinking said:
"Oh, I'm a Reylo-er." I wish you could have seen their faces. It was like I had said: "I kill puppies."


I was bombarded with ridicule first stating there was no sexual energy, then they moved onto incest, and finally the "Kylo coming onto Rey rapey-ness" or some such nonsense.
My Reylo faith is not shaken easily, but the amount of negativity was startling and left me questioning myself. I was too scared to say anything else, so I kept my trap shut...not that it would have mattered anyway I had pretty much been dumped into the dunce corner at that point, after they decided my observations were invalid.
But had I found the guts, I would have posed two questions to them:
1) They said they found the scenes with Rey and Kylo, Rapey. This means that they noticed some kind of sexual energy. Blatantly saying there was no sexual energy is a hypocritical statement. So why are they denying what is on screen?
2) If JJ had planned for Rey and Kylo to be cousins wouldn't said sexual energy have been omitted entirely? And more still, if KYLO knew he and Rey were cousins, why was he allowed to be so suggestive in his scenes with Rey?
...Phew! That felt like therapy...Ha!

I'm getting together with my really "hard core" Star Wars friends next week. They live and breathe it, they're whole families do really. I'm planning on getting their stance on Reylo, now that I'm armed with metas and in depth analyses of what we see. They will respect that, they are very analytical and scholar type people, their opinions coming in second to fact. If they say anything interesting, I'll be sure to transcribe and post a snippet and see what you guys think.

@Krafty

Here's something that might help you feel better and I'm being totally honest. My mother is a huge Star Wars fan but also always right about everything she thinks will happen in what we read and watch. During the first season of the anime Naruto she said Hinata and Naruto will get together. Almost 10 years later it happened lol and when we watched TFA I said "Finn likes Rey and I want you to tell me if you think they will end up together." She watched it and when it was over said "Finn is just a really good friend but I am pretty sure Rey and Ben will end up together." Then she went on about how he acts around her, looks at her, talks to her and she also noticed the sexual tension. Let's see if her streak of being right is still on track in a few years lol

@ladyconsular

Gosh, I hope your mother is right! My mother also thought the same thing! My house is divided though... My mom and I are pretty sure there is something going on with Rey and Kylo, my father says- no way (he's a die hard Reywalker), and my sister is now undecided having been squarely in the Reywalker camp until I said I saw some weirdness between Rey and Kylo that she also noticed (she told me a couple times she thought they were going to kiss). Its only a matter of time now before she turns

@Krafty

Personally I think the only way any of us Reylo believers could be wrong is if the people behind VIII and IX decided to completely disregard their interactions in VII and rewrite their characters. I don't see them doing that, even if anti's threatened and complained.

CienaRee wrote:Lol,I was going throug the anti-reyo tag just to compare with the Reylo on(there's no comarison the Reylo tag on tumblr is one hudnred percent better than the anti one and I'm not syaing this as shipper it's just so much better over all)and I stumbled on this blog called Rey against reylo(I kid you not that's the name of the blog)and I couldn't believe that this gufset comapring Reylo vs Finnrey with a quote about racism below has got over 5 thousand likes  
http://reyagainstreylo.tumblr.com/post/145580481417/phamsa-there-is-racism-in-the-writing-of
Like  the maker of this gift toally twisted it to make it look like Reylo is indeed some twisted relationship and the only reasons Reylof ans love it is because they're racist.
“There is racism in the writing of thousands of words’ worth of dissertation exploring the possibilities of Kylo Ren’s character based on the qualities and story arc that Finn has already shown and whose own plotline is canonically more feasible to what you lot claim as a powerful connection with Rey than the character who is the villain and has done nothing positive for/towards Rey. You lot have blatantly erased Finn’s characterization and actions. This is not isolated in that article. It’s a sentiment repeated continually by shippers that somehow pop-up in the FinnRey, Finn, and other tags. […] You lot are so concerned that you’re being accused of racism and instead of investigating yourselves of the inherent prejudices you might have, you decide to separate yourself from “the rest” which does nothing to quell the problem. Saying that majority of you are not racist does not magically negate r*ylo shippers from baring real-life prejudices that bleed into the consumption and interpretation of fiction. Your intent, no matter how positive you think it is, does not negate the impact of your and your lot’s actions, words, and works, that reek of internalized racism.

@CienaRee

Oh, that's sad. I thought it was an older post, but no. Did this person not read JB's interview? Or the extras in the DVDs? Finn and Rey are just friends!

And it's funny cause the first gif is when he holds her hand against her will. Nobody is going to say anything about that? I know, it's comic relief, but I personally don't like to be touched without consent, or having my no ignored. Not that I'm going to start claiming Finn is an abuser, it's just ridiculous that someone would put a gif of Rey being uncomfortable with Finn's touching as an example of a positive relationship.

I wish JBs words stopped this nonsense about racism. It's not about Kylo vs. Finn. Each of them have their own role in the story. Finn's role is not Rey's LI, and people should be happy he'll have his own arc. And on racism... ugh, had Finn been portrayed in a flattering way, looking good, looking at Rey as more than a friend, etc. then we could perhaps talk about racism guiding people's choices. Finn is not portrayed as a romantic interest. Asking "Do you have a boyfriend" in a super high voice doesn't portray him as a romantic interest. I trust that JB did it on purpose, to show them as buddies. I think he's very honest when he says they were never meant to be perceived as romantic, and that he was not playing romance.

Force22 wrote:

CienaRee wrote:Lol,I was going throug the anti-reyo tag just to compare with the Reylo on(there's no comarison the Reylo tag on tumblr is one hudnred percent better than the anti one and I'm not syaing this as shipper it's just so much better over all)and I stumbled on this blog called Rey against reylo(I kid you not that's the name of the blog)and I couldn't believe that this gufset comapring Reylo vs Finnrey with a quote about racism below has got over 5 thousand likes  
http://reyagainstreylo.tumblr.com/post/145580481417/phamsa-there-is-racism-in-the-writing-of
Like  the maker of this gift toally twisted it to make it look like Reylo is indeed some twisted relationship and the only reasons Reylof ans love it is because they're racist.
“There is racism in the writing of thousands of words’ worth of dissertation exploring the possibilities of Kylo Ren’s character based on the qualities and story arc that Finn has already shown and whose own plotline is canonically more feasible to what you lot claim as a powerful connection with Rey than the character who is the villain and has done nothing positive for/towards Rey. You lot have blatantly erased Finn’s characterization and actions. This is not isolated in that article. It’s a sentiment repeated continually by shippers that somehow pop-up in the FinnRey, Finn, and other tags. […] You lot are so concerned that you’re being accused of racism and instead of investigating yourselves of the inherent prejudices you might have, you decide to separate yourself from “the rest” which does nothing to quell the problem. Saying that majority of you are not racist does not magically negate r*ylo shippers from baring real-life prejudices that bleed into the consumption and interpretation of fiction. Your intent, no matter how positive you think it is, does not negate the impact of your and your lot’s actions, words, and works, that reek of internalized racism.

@CienaRee

Oh, that's sad. I thought it was an older post, but no. Did this person not read JB's interview? Or the extras in the DVDs? Finn and Rey are just friends!

And it's funny cause the first gif is when he holds her hand against her will. Nobody is going to say anything about that? I know, it's comic relief, but I personally don't like to be touched without consent, or having my no ignored. Not that I'm going to start claiming Finn is an abuser, it's just ridiculous that someone would put a gif of Rey being uncomfortable with Finn's touching as an example of a positive relationship.

I wish JBs words stopped this nonsense about racism. It's not about Kylo vs. Finn. Each of them have their own role in the story. Finn's role is not Rey's LI, and people should be happy he'll have his own arc. And on racism... ugh, had Finn been portrayed in a flattering way, looking good, looking at Rey as more than a friend, etc. then we could perhaps talk about racism guiding people's choices. Finn is not portrayed as a romantic interest. Asking "Do you have a boyfriend" in a super high voice doesn't portray him as a romantic interest. I trust that JB did it on purpose, to show them as buddies. I think he's very honest when he says they were never meant to be perceived as romantic, and that he was not playing romance.

@Force22

Have you seen some of the media's reaction to JB's comment? There's a few that took it as canon and reported it as John saying Finn and Rey will have a romance together that won't go like we expect.

JB also likes Naruto and relates Finn to him and Naruto was crazy about Sakura for a long time, and yet fell in love with Hinata, and Sakura helped bring Sasuke back from his dark path (love redeemed him) and they married.

ladyconsular wrote:
Have you seen some of the media's reaction to JB's comment? There's a few that took it as canon and reported it as John saying Finn and Rey will have a romance together that won't go like we expect.

JB also likes Naruto and relates Finn to him and Naruto was crazy about Sakura for a long time, and yet fell in love with Hinata, and Sakura helped bring Sasuke back from his dark path (love redeemed him) and they married.

@ladyconsular

Man alive, they will twist anything any way they want, won't they? I thought JB's quote was crystal clear (and I'm glad it came from him btw), but there are those who still refuse to believe it.

Pure comedy, that bunch...

It simply doesn't matter how certain viewers or certain media interpret the characters or how they try to twist the words of those involved with production to suit their personal delusions. We have the narrative structure and the actors' own words to back us up. That should be enough.

Btw, for the record, I avoid reading any of these pathetic misinterpretations and rely merely on official sources and on you guys. I will never let myself be negatively influenced by such nonsense. It's sad that some people seem to be frozen in time and still live in December 2015, but it cannot be helped. Only episode VIII can shut them up once and for all. And even if it doesn't, it won't change the story.

There is no argument going on here. An actual argument would need two sides of the debate. Here, there's only one and it's called common sense.

Queen of the Knights wrote:It simply doesn't matter how certain viewers or certain media interpret the characters or how they try to twist the words of those involved with production to suit their personal delusions. We have the narrative structure and the actors' own words to back us up. That should be enough.

Btw, for the record, I avoid reading any of these pathetic misinterpretations and rely merely on official sources and on you guys. I will never let myself be negatively influenced by such nonsense. It's sad they some people seem to be frozen in time and still live inn December 2015, but it cannot be helped. Only episode VIII can shut them up once and for all. And even if it doesn't, it won't change the story.

@Queen of the Knights

I agree. It's sad anti's use those false or twisted reports to attack us with, but just because they see things one way doesn't mean we have to see it the same way too. I'll never understand many of the ships people like, but I won't attack them for it or make them feel bad or question their own beliefs. Even if Reylo is never canon, I enjoy reading the fanfics and looking at the beautiful art and after years of being caught in shipping wars at anime boards, I've learned to enjoy what I like and believe, no matter what actually happens.

To me, the Kylo and Rey relationship has never been a "ship". I don't consider it fan fiction, it's a logical progression of the story they started. I would never root for something that exists purely in my imagination because that will inevitably lead to dissapointment. Also, I believe all the posters here are intelligent enough and don't need someone else to interpret the movie for them. That's why I don't read comments or reviews, I have my own brain, thank you very much. I wouldn't let these spoil or bias my initial feel for the movie.

It's the healthiest way to see things and less likely to get us arguing with those that attempt to make it into something it's not. We didn't just imagine Reylo. It's there. However with trilogy's, I'm always open-minded to drastic changes because sometimes they forget things from previous episodes or the person in charge now might not like what was already written and come up with something else. I doubt it's the case with this, but I think I've been disappointed so many times in the past, I just try and balance my feelings now lol

Queen of the Knights wrote:To me, the Kylo and Rey relationship has never been a "ship". I don't consider it fan fiction, it's a logical progression of the story they started. I would never root for something that exists purely in my imagination because that will inevitably lead to dissapointment. Also, I believe all the posters here are intelligent enough and don't need someone else to interpret the movie for them. That's why I don't read comments or reviews, I have my own brain, thank you very much. I wouldn't let these spoil or bias my initial feel for the movie.

@Queen of the Knights

^^^Exactly! All of this! I think we've been dancing around this point recently and you put it into words beautifully! Well done!

CienaRee wrote:Lol,I was going throug the anti-reyo tag just to compare with the Reylo on(there's no comarison the Reylo tag on tumblr is one hudnred percent better than the anti one and I'm not syaing this as shipper it's just so much better over all)and I stumbled on this blog called Rey against reylo(I kid you not that's the name of the blog)and I couldn't believe that this gufset comapring Reylo vs Finnrey with a quote about racism below has got over 5 thousand likes  
http://reyagainstreylo.tumblr.com/post/145580481417/phamsa-there-is-racism-in-the-writing-of
Like  the maker of this gift toally twisted it to make it look like Reylo is indeed some twisted relationship and the only reasons Reylof ans love it is because they're racist.
“There is racism in the writing of thousands of words’ worth of dissertation exploring the possibilities of Kylo Ren’s character based on the qualities and story arc that Finn has already shown and whose own plotline is canonically more feasible to what you lot claim as a powerful connection with Rey than the character who is the villain and has done nothing positive for/towards Rey. You lot have blatantly erased Finn’s characterization and actions. This is not isolated in that article. It’s a sentiment repeated continually by shippers that somehow pop-up in the FinnRey, Finn, and other tags. […] You lot are so concerned that you’re being accused of racism and instead of investigating yourselves of the inherent prejudices you might have, you decide to separate yourself from “the rest” which does nothing to quell the problem. Saying that majority of you are not racist does not magically negate r*ylo shippers from baring real-life prejudices that bleed into the consumption and interpretation of fiction. Your intent, no matter how positive you think it is, does not negate the impact of your and your lot’s actions, words, and works, that reek of internalized racism.

@CienaRee

From the Admin of that blog:

Hey, I’m Admin or Rey.

I’m underage, in high school (not gonna get more specific than that), and mentally ill + neurodivergent. I have D.I.D., depression, anxiety, and I am autistic. This may affect my activity on this blog.

Queen of the Knights wrote:To me, the Kylo and Rey relationship has never been a "ship". I don't consider it fan fiction, it's a logical progression of the story they started. I would never root for something that exists purely in my imagination because that will inevitably lead to dissapointment. Also, I believe all the posters here are intelligent enough and don't need someone else to interpret the movie for them. That's why I don't read comments or reviews, I have my own brain, thank you very much. I wouldn't let these spoil or bias my initial feel for the movie.

@Queen of the Knights

So much this! I wouldn't be on this forum, or be so invested in this if I thought it were a crack ship. I saw what I saw, and I know it's true - all of it! Body language and those types of camera angles are not put in film unless it is where the story leads. I'm surprised at the amount of Reylo fans on tumblr who don't believe it will be canon!

I never thought Rey was Luke's, but I get it if you think that, you might believe Reylo to be a crack ship. The thing is, one or the other is true - it can't be both obviously.

I understand now why the Reywalker red herring was added to the story, but honestly if you see Reylo (and once you see it, it can't be unseen), Reywalker is automatically debunked. Ask yourself which is the better story, and once you have the answer, that one is going to take precedence over the other.

IoJovi wrote:

Queen of the Knights wrote:To me, the Kylo and Rey relationship has never been a "ship". I don't consider it fan fiction, it's a logical progression of the story they started. I would never root for something that exists purely in my imagination because that will inevitably lead to dissapointment. Also, I believe all the posters here are intelligent enough and don't need someone else to interpret the movie for them. That's why I don't read comments or reviews, I have my own brain, thank you very much. I wouldn't let these spoil or bias my initial feel for the movie.

@Queen of the Knights

So much this!  I wouldn't be on this forum, or be so invested in this if I thought it were a crack ship.  I saw what I saw, and I know it's true - all of it!   Body language and those types of camera angles are not put in film unless it is where the story leads.  I'm surprised at the amount of Reylo fans on tumblr who don't believe it will be canon!  

I never thought Rey was Luke's, but I get it if you think that, you might believe Reylo to be a crack ship.  The thing is, one or the other is true - it can't be both obviously.    

I understand now why the Reywalker red herring was added to the story, but honestly if you see Reylo (and once you see it, it can't be unseen), Reywalker is automatically debunked.  Ask yourself which is the better story, and once you have the answer, that one is going to take precedence over the other.  

@IoJovi

Very well said! I always prepare for the worst, but in my heart, nothing can convince me Reylo is not real. Also if Rey and Kylo were related, I doubt Daisy would favorite Reylo art or comment on Relyo Instagram accounts. She also said she already knows who Rey's parents are.

IoJovi wrote:

Queen of the Knights wrote:To me, the Kylo and Rey relationship has never been a "ship". I don't consider it fan fiction, it's a logical progression of the story they started. I would never root for something that exists purely in my imagination because that will inevitably lead to dissapointment. Also, I believe all the posters here are intelligent enough and don't need someone else to interpret the movie for them. That's why I don't read comments or reviews, I have my own brain, thank you very much. I wouldn't let these spoil or bias my initial feel for the movie.

@Queen of the Knights

So much this! I wouldn't be on this forum, or be so invested in this if I thought it were a crack ship. I saw what I saw, and I know it's true - all of it! Body language and those types of camera angles are not put in film unless it is where the story leads. I'm surprised at the amount of Reylo fans on tumblr who don't believe it will be canon!

I never thought Rey was Luke's, but I get it if you think that, you might believe Reylo to be a crack ship. The thing is, one or the other is true - it can't be both obviously.

I understand now why the Reywalker red herring was added to the story, but honestly if you see Reylo (and once you see it, it can't be unseen), Reywalker is automatically debunked. Ask yourself which is the better story, and once you have the answer, that one is going to take precedence over the other.

@IoJovi

I understand why some Reylos on Tumblr don't believe it will be canon. I'm keeping some slack myself because I really don't want to be massively disappointed in 2017 or 2019, even though I'm pretty much 85% sure at this point it will become a two-sided canon romantic relationship.

But you know - people have been disappointed in the past about their ships (a lot of Reylo shippers were in the Zutara fandom, for instance), and they don't want it to happen again. It's understandable.

Mana wrote:aw, sorry folks...but Finn has nothing to do with what's going on between Rey and Kylo...its Rey, Kylo and Luke on Ach-to. Finn's in the B-plot, and that's not because anyone's racist..its because his story is in the B-plot and that's the way it is.

@Mana

As someone who likes Finn I would rather he be number 1 in the B plot than number 4 in the A plot. Being the Star in the secondary story will allow him to shine and grow more.

Darth Dementor wrote:

Mana wrote:aw, sorry folks...but Finn has nothing to do with what's going on between Rey and Kylo...its Rey, Kylo and Luke on Ach-to. Finn's in the B-plot, and that's not because anyone's racist..its because his story is in the B-plot and that's the way it is.

@Mana

As someone who likes Finn I would rather he be number 1 in the B plot than number 4 in the A plot. Being the Star in the secondary story will allow him to shine and grow more.

@Darth Dementor

^^^^ THIS.

Finn deserves more than to be Rey's sidekick. I'm sorry, but yeah.

I saw this video  from  an  anti reylo fan   and it discusses how fiction can change a person's POV:
http://ed.ted.com/lessons/jessica-wise-how-fiction-can-change-reality
The anti gave this as an example to why Reylo is abusive and people shouldn't ship it ( ) while answering a question by a Reylo fan:

Reylo shippers don't think their mature and intelligent because they ship Reylo. They are mature because they don't think everything is about them and don't go around shitting on other people and their ships. And they're more intelligent because they know that there is literally nothing wrong about any fictional ship. Fight that.

Gladly.

(Just realized I don’t have a discourse tag yet. Um… blacklist ‘jules rants’ if you don’t wanna see my arguments and stuff?)

First: I’m not sure if you’re aware of this, but the reason I posted this was because of a very long Reylo post which I saw a few days ago. (Unfortunately, I’m having a terrible time finding it again.) Here’s my original rant on the subject, though it gets a tad personal and rant-y and stuff.

It started out as ‘share your age’ sort of thing and, after someone replied saying that they thought Reylos were more mature/intelligent because only people who are mature/intelligent can understand the nuances/subtext of their ship, there were a string of comments agreeing wholeheartedly.

(If this was just one post with a few notes, I wouldn’t be as bothered by it. But there were many, many comments on that post agreeing, so I have to conclude that it’s an attitude shared by at least a part of the Reylo fandom. This is the part of the fandom which I was asking, specifically, to fight me, but I’m fine with someone who doesn’t know the original context too.)

So actually, there are Reylos who seriously believe that understanding their ship requires a certain maturity level, and thus dismiss those who don’t ‘understand’ (read: criticize) Reylo as ‘immature’ and ‘childish’ and act as if that invalidates any criticisms directed towards their ship. Which it doesn’t, by the way.

I’m not even gonna go into how wrong that belief is (though I’d love to), because that’s getting off topic.

Second: “They are mature because they don’t think everything is about them and don’t go around shitting on other people and their ships.”

I like to understand both sides of an issue, so while I am anti-Reylo, I have spent time in the Reylo tag, searching for posts which explain why they ship what they do. And during my time in the tag, I’ve seen a lot of Reylos who actually do think everything in TFA is about their ship (cross-tagging, taking moments which have nothing to do with their ship and twisting them so that somehow that moment ‘proves’ their ship, commenting on actors’ posts which have nothing to do with Reylo, etc.), and I’ve seen a lot of Reylos go around shitting on antis, even those who are survivors of abuse and feel extremely uncomfortable with this ship.

Of course, you could just argue ‘well, that’s not the mature part of the fandom, that’s not who I’m talking about, so your above paragraph is invalid’, and in that case, okay, fine. But the people commenting on that post sure as hell didn’t seem mature when they were shitting on someone who dared to say ‘um, maybe intelligence level doesn’t correspond with shipping preferences’, so I find it rather ironic that they were the people claiming they were the mature ones.

If this is aimed at me, well, whatever. I don’t think everything is about me, and I’m not ‘going around’ shitting on ships. I could keep on arguing about this but I’m not here to talk about me, so -

Third: “And they’re more intelligent because they know that there is literally nothing wrong about any fictional ship.”

Um… yeah, no.

If you mean that there is no fictional ship which may have something wrong with it: Fictional ships can have issues, just like real life relationships.

If you mean that there is nothing wrong with shipping a certain fictional ship because it’s fiction and thus not real, and thus cannot affect real life… I hate to break it to you, buddy, but that’s not true.

Fiction may be, well, fiction, but that doesn’t mean it cannot affect reality. Satire pieces written to criticize an aspect of their society at the time have changed people’s opinions, science fiction has inspired actual inventions based off of the tech in that fictional universe…. Fiction is not only a product of people, their imagination, and the world which they are a part of, but also affects people who interact with it. It’s been proven.

This goes for fictional ships, as well. Abusive ships like Reylo (this argument isn’t about why it’s abusive, but there are many, many posts discussing why it is which you can find) normalize abusive relationships in real life. People see Kylo’s behavior portrayed as ‘romantic’ instead of terrifying enough times, and they’ll start believing it.

I know there are many different ways people ship Reylo - probably as many different ways as there are shippers. Some ways may be less problematic than others. However, shipping it a ‘different way’ does not escape the fact that supporting this ship (regardless of how you do it!) supports the idea that this ship is okay based only on canon material, which… no offense, but it’s not.

As someone who stayed in an abusive friendship for nearly three years because I was led to believe I could ‘change him’, that it was my job to, because I saw that expectation around me in both fiction and real life, I’m speaking from unfortunate experience. There can be very harmful effects due to certain ships, and I’d say that would make shipping/supporting that ship wrong to at least some degree.

Note: I don’t have an issue with Reylos who acknowledge the problematic aspects of their ship instead of dismissing them and joking about or romanticizing these problems. The thing is, I haven’t actually come across a Reylo like that yet. well maybe one who i follow and is awesome but still
http://fandoms-and-physics.tumblr.com/post/145608545392/reylo-shippers-dont-think-their-mature-and

[quote="BenRey"]

CienaRee wrote:Lol,I was going throug the anti-reyo tag just to compare with the Reylo on(there's no comarison the Reylo tag on tumblr is one hudnred percent better than the anti one and I'm not syaing this as shipper it's just so much better over all)and I stumbled on this blog called Rey against reylo(I kid you not that's the name of the blog)and I couldn't believe that this gufset comapring Reylo vs Finnrey with a quote about racism below has got over 5 thousand likes  
http://reyagainstreylo.tumblr.com/post/145580481417/phamsa-there-is-racism-in-the-writing-of
Like  the maker of this gift toally twisted it to make it look like Reylo is indeed some twisted relationship and the only reasons Reylof ans love it is because they're racist.
“There is racism in the writing of thousands of words’ worth of dissertation exploring the possibilities of Kylo Ren’s character based on the qualities and story arc that Finn has already shown and whose own plotline is canonically more feasible to what you lot claim as a powerful connection with Rey than the character who is the villain and has done nothing positive for/towards Rey. You lot have blatantly erased Finn’s characterization and actions. This is not isolated in that article. It’s a sentiment repeated continually by shippers that somehow pop-up in the FinnRey, Finn, and other tags. […] You lot are so concerned that you’re being accused of racism and instead of investigating yourselves of the inherent prejudices you might have, you decide to separate yourself from “the rest” which does nothing to quell the problem. Saying that majority of you are not racist does not magically negate r*ylo shippers from baring real-life prejudices that bleed into the consumption and interpretation of fiction. Your intent, no matter how positive you think it is, does not negate the impact of your and your lot’s actions, words, and works, that reek of internalized racism.

@CienaRee

From the Admin of that blog:


[quote]Hey, I’m Admin or Rey.

I’m underage, in high school (not gonna get more specific than that), and mentally ill + neurodivergent. I have D.I.D., depression, anxiety, and I am autistic. [b]This may affect my activity on this blog.[/b

Frankly, we don't owe anyone an explanation. Until they can grow a brain and make a coherent argument, they can sit down and shut up because right now they are in the wrong classroom.

Slade wrote:

BenRey wrote:

CienaRee wrote:Lol,I was going throug the anti-reyo tag just to compare with the Reylo on(there's no comarison the Reylo tag on tumblr is one hudnred percent better than the anti one and I'm not syaing this as shipper it's just so much better over all)and I stumbled on this blog called Rey against reylo(I kid you not that's the name of the blog)and I couldn't believe that this gufset comapring Reylo vs Finnrey with a quote about racism below has got over 5 thousand likes  
http://reyagainstreylo.tumblr.com/post/145580481417/phamsa-there-is-racism-in-the-writing-of
Like  the maker of this gift toally twisted it to make it look like Reylo is indeed some twisted relationship and the only reasons Reylof ans love it is because they're racist.
“There is racism in the writing of thousands of words’ worth of dissertation exploring the possibilities of Kylo Ren’s character based on the qualities and story arc that Finn has already shown and whose own plotline is canonically more feasible to what you lot claim as a powerful connection with Rey than the character who is the villain and has done nothing positive for/towards Rey. You lot have blatantly erased Finn’s characterization and actions. This is not isolated in that article. It’s a sentiment repeated continually by shippers that somehow pop-up in the FinnRey, Finn, and other tags. […] You lot are so concerned that you’re being accused of racism and instead of investigating yourselves of the inherent prejudices you might have, you decide to separate yourself from “the rest” which does nothing to quell the problem. Saying that majority of you are not racist does not magically negate r*ylo shippers from baring real-life prejudices that bleed into the consumption and interpretation of fiction. Your intent, no matter how positive you think it is, does not negate the impact of your and your lot’s actions, words, and works, that reek of internalized racism.

@CienaRee

From the Admin of that blog:

Hey, I’m Admin or Rey.

I’m underage, in high school (not gonna get more specific than that), and mentally ill + neurodivergent. I have D.I.D., depression, anxiety, and I am autistic. This may affect my activity on this blog.

@BenRey

High school. Mentally ill. autistic. Not making fun of this person, but that explains a lot.

@Slade

The problem with some of the antis are that they genuinely believe that by ranting over and over about how Reylo is abusive they're somehow protecting those who ship the couple from getting into an absuive relationship because accoridng to them they can't make a difference between fiction and relaity.
You know I might have given them them the benefit of the doubt if many of them weren't actually teenagers.
I feel for and repsedt those who have been in abusive relationships but the fact is that Reylo's not in an abusive relationship.Kyloa nd rey have known each other for a day and are adversaries at this point.It's like because Rey's a woman Kylo has to treat her like an innocent floewr and not fight her at all.Yet when Reylo shippers try to point out that Rey beat Kylo in the interrogation room they immediatly go ''Well she ahd no chocie it doesn't mean she's not his victim.''
I find it ironic that some feminists want strong female characters yet when they get one they immediatly try to paint them as victim because they got hurt by the villain  and yet I'm pretty sure they would ahve complained if the villain tretaed the female heroine differently ebcause she's a woman.

Just stating for the record, I'm a teenager who does not find Reylo abusive at all. Going back to the maturity thing, I'm not sure it's so much that Reylos are more or less mature (or whatever the going thought is from the antis) but rather it's more about perception. My radar is finely honed to dynamics that I find interesting in films and novels, and not all of them are romantic. I have no idea what the age curve looks like among Reylos...and with all due respect I don't care. I Care about thoughtful observations and insight and this can come from anyone no matter what age or background. I love all of us! Haha!